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Old 04-23-2010, 03:12 PM
Devrim GÜNDÜZ
 
Default Postgresql namespace

On Fri, 2010-04-23 at 16:40 +0200, Miroslav Suchý wrote:
> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=251805#c28
>
> Should we have:
> postgresql-pgpool-II
> postgresql-orafce
>
> or just:
> pgpool-II
> orafce
>
> Let start discussing. My opinion is postgresql-* because it has kind
> of same namespace.

Let's get rid of postgresql- prefixes. They don't match upstream names
and they are just useless.

I'll change the names in rawhide next week or so.
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PostgreSQL RPM Repository: http://yum.pgrpms.org
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Old 04-23-2010, 03:44 PM
Tom Lane
 
Default Postgresql namespace

Devrim =?ISO-8859-1?Q?G=DCND=DCZ?= <fedora-list@gunduz.org> writes:
> On Fri, 2010-04-23 at 16:40 +0200, Miroslav Suchý wrote:
>> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=251805#c28
>>
>> Should we have:
>> postgresql-pgpool-II
>> postgresql-orafce
>>
>> or just:
>> pgpool-II
>> orafce
>>
>> Let start discussing. My opinion is postgresql-* because it has kind
>> of same namespace.

> Let's get rid of postgresql- prefixes. They don't match upstream names
> and they are just useless.

FWIW, I've recently renamed postgresql-tcl and postgresql-python to
better match their upstream project names, so I guess that's precedent
for Devrim's position.

regards, tom lane
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Old 04-23-2010, 04:31 PM
Jesse Keating
 
Default Postgresql namespace

On Fri, 2010-04-23 at 11:44 -0400, Tom Lane wrote:
> Devrim =?ISO-8859-1?Q?G=DCND=DCZ?= <fedora-list@gunduz.org> writes:
> > On Fri, 2010-04-23 at 16:40 +0200, Miroslav Such wrote:
> >> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=251805#c28
> >>
> >> Should we have:
> >> postgresql-pgpool-II
> >> postgresql-orafce
> >>
> >> or just:
> >> pgpool-II
> >> orafce
> >>
> >> Let start discussing. My opinion is postgresql-* because it has kind
> >> of same namespace.
>
> > Let's get rid of postgresql- prefixes. They don't match upstream names
> > and they are just useless.
>
> FWIW, I've recently renamed postgresql-tcl and postgresql-python to
> better match their upstream project names, so I guess that's precedent
> for Devrim's position.
>
> regards, tom lane

It's also worth noting what other distributions do, do they honor the
upstream names or pre/postpend some sort of identifier?

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Old 04-23-2010, 06:47 PM
Jean-Francois Saucier
 
Default Postgresql namespace

> On Fri, 2010-04-23 at 11:44 -0400, Tom Lane wrote:
> Devrim =?ISO-8859-1?Q?G=DCND=DCZ?= <fedora-list at gunduz.org> writes:
> > On Fri, 2010-04-23 at 16:40 +0200, Miroslav Such wrote:
> >> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=251805#c28
> >>
> >> Should we have:
> >> postgresql-pgpool-II
> >> postgresql-orafce
> >>
> >> or just:
> >> pgpool-II
> >> orafce
> >>
> >> Let start discussing. My opinion is postgresql-* because it has kind
> >> of same namespace.
>
> > Let's get rid of postgresql- prefixes. They don't match upstream names
> > and they are just useless.
>
> FWIW, I've recently renamed postgresql-tcl and postgresql-python to
> better match their upstream project names, so I guess that's precedent
> for Devrim's position.
>
> regards, tom lane

> It's also worth noting what other distributions do, do they honor the
> upstream names or pre/postpend some sort of identifier?


If I check in the Ubuntu Lucid repository, orafce is packaged as
postgresql-8.3-orafce, same for Debian.

OpenSuse and Mandriva don't seem to ship orafce.


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Old 04-23-2010, 08:01 PM
Matthias Runge
 
Default Postgresql namespace

On 04/23/2010 08:47 PM, Jean-Francois Saucier wrote:
>> On Fri, 2010-04-23 at 11:44 -0400, Tom Lane wrote:
>> Devrim =?ISO-8859-1?Q?G=DCND=DCZ?=<fedora-list at gunduz.org> writes:
>>> On Fri, 2010-04-23 at 16:40 +0200, Miroslav Such wrote:
>>>> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=251805#c28
>>>>
>>>> Should we have:
>>>> postgresql-pgpool-II
>>>> postgresql-orafce
>>>>
>>>> or just:
>>>> pgpool-II
>>>> orafce
>>>>
>>>> Let start discussing. My opinion is postgresql-* because it has kind
>>>> of same namespace.
>>
>>> Let's get rid of postgresql- prefixes. They don't match upstream names
>>> and they are just useless.
>>
>> FWIW, I've recently renamed postgresql-tcl and postgresql-python to
>> better match their upstream project names, so I guess that's precedent
>> for Devrim's position.
>>
>> regards, tom lane
>
>> It's also worth noting what other distributions do, do they honor the
>> upstream names or pre/postpend some sort of identifier?
>
>
> If I check in the Ubuntu Lucid repository, orafce is packaged as
> postgresql-8.3-orafce, same for Debian.
>
> OpenSuse and Mandriva don't seem to ship orafce.
>
>
>

Thinking of more general packages, e.g a java binding for postgresql, I
would prefer names like postgresql-java (or similar) to be able to
differentiate from mysql-java, ingres-java (given, those packages do
exist). To be conformant to this naming scheme, other packages, that do
only exist e.g. for postgresql, should IMHO be named postgresql-something.

Even a search on packages gets you faster to results just by browsing
package names (yes, I know yum is pretty smart and does not need that.)

Cheers,
Matthias
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Old 04-23-2010, 08:22 PM
Tom Lane
 
Default Postgresql namespace

Matthias Runge <mrunge@matthias-runge.de> writes:
> Thinking of more general packages, e.g a java binding for postgresql, I
> would prefer names like postgresql-java (or similar) to be able to
> differentiate from mysql-java, ingres-java (given, those packages do
> exist). To be conformant to this naming scheme, other packages, that do
> only exist e.g. for postgresql, should IMHO be named postgresql-something.

More often than not, database/language binding packages are already
subject to some other naming convention associated with the language.
For instance, the tcl, perl, and python bindings all are subject to
conventions suggesting that their names ought to start with tcl-, perl-,
python- respectively. So I think we'd be getting into trouble if we try
to establish naming conventions that put the database first.

We could perhaps do things one way for bindings and another way for
packages that are purely internal to the database, but I'm not finding
that to be a compelling idea. I think "name it after the upstream
project" is a good enough rule.

regards, tom lane
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Old 04-26-2010, 06:49 AM
Devrim GÜNDÜZ
 
Default Postgresql namespace

On Fri, 2010-04-23 at 14:47 -0400, Jean-Francois Saucier wrote:
> If I check in the Ubuntu Lucid repository, orafce is packaged as
> postgresql-8.3-orafce, same for Debian.

It is probably because they ship different PostgreSQL versions in each
distro. Fedora does not have this yet (FWIW, I'm working on this in my
repository: http://yum.pgrpms.org and as of PostgreSQL 9.0, it will be
supported for Fedora/CentOS).

I did not use the Debian way, so we won't need postgresql-9.0-orafce
thing (I hope).

--
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PostgreSQL Danışmanı/Consultant, Red Hat Certified Engineer
PostgreSQL RPM Repository: http://yum.pgrpms.org
Community: devrim~PostgreSQL.org, devrim.gunduz~linux.org.tr
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Old 04-26-2010, 06:52 AM
Rahul Sundaram
 
Default Postgresql namespace

On 04/26/2010 12:19 PM, Devrim GNDZ wrote:
> On Fri, 2010-04-23 at 14:47 -0400, Jean-Francois Saucier wrote:
>
>> If I check in the Ubuntu Lucid repository, orafce is packaged as
>> postgresql-8.3-orafce, same for Debian.
>>
> It is probably because they ship different PostgreSQL versions in each
> distro. Fedora does not have this yet (FWIW, I'm working on this in my
> repository: http://yum.pgrpms.org and as of PostgreSQL 9.0, it will be
> supported for Fedora/CentOS).

Any reason not to have it in the Fedora repo instead of your own?

Rahul

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Old 04-26-2010, 11:17 AM
Devrim GÜNDÜZ
 
Default Postgresql namespace

On Mon, 2010-04-26 at 12:22 +0530, Rahul Sundaram wrote:
> Any reason not to have it in the Fedora repo instead of your own?

I'm not the maintainer of PostgreSQL package in Fedora/RHEL. Tom (Lane)
has been already maintaining it and doing very good job over there at
Red Hat. He will *probably* do the same for Fedora when 9.0 goes beta or
so. I am the upstream packager only.

FWIW, since Fedora/RHEL (up to 5.5) does support only 1 PostgreSQL
version w/ RPMs, this 3rd party repository helps people to use recent
PG versions with their distros. (Majority of our users are RHEL 5 users,
who use PostgreSQL 8.3 and 8.4 on RHEL 5). I'm sure that's one of the
reasons that RHEL 5.5 shipped PostgreSQL 8.4 along with 8.1.

Regards,
--
Devrim GÜNDÜZ
PostgreSQL Danışmanı/Consultant, Red Hat Certified Engineer
PostgreSQL RPM Repository: http://yum.pgrpms.org
Community: devrim~PostgreSQL.org, devrim.gunduz~linux.org.tr
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Old 04-26-2010, 11:28 AM
Rahul Sundaram
 
Default Postgresql namespace

On 04/26/2010 04:47 PM, Devrim GNDZ wrote
> FWIW, since Fedora/RHEL (up to 5.5) does support only 1 PostgreSQL
> version w/ RPMs, this 3rd party repository helps people to use recent
> PG versions with their distros. (Majority of our users are RHEL 5 users,
> who use PostgreSQL 8.3 and 8.4 on RHEL 5). I'm sure that's one of the
> reasons that RHEL 5.5 shipped PostgreSQL 8.4 along with 8.1.
>

Perhaps I was not clear but my question was if multiple of Postgres is a
useful to thing to have, why don't we do it in the Fedora repo instead
of having users seek out and use a third party repo?

Rahul
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