On Thu, 2010-04-01 at 00:45 +0530, Rahul Sundaram wrote:
> On 04/01/2010 12:42 AM, Adam Williamson wrote:
> >
> > An alternative is to change the version to Rawhide and then you can use
> > CLOSED RAWHIDE. You should usually have the reporter's agreement before
> > doing this, though.
> >
> > Once again I note that Launchpad handles this noticeably better than
> > Bugzilla.

> Well, then let's fix bugzilla to adopt launchpad improvements or just
> adopt launchpad.

As I said in another mail, Launchpad isn't better in all respects, it's
not a simple decision. Also, currently Bugzilla is shared with Red Hat
and hence benefits from management by dkl and other RH staff; I doubt RH
would switch from Bugzilla, so if Fedora wanted to adopt something RH
could not use, Fedora would have to provide the person-hours to
implement and maintain the new system.

It'd be nice to have better handling for this in a future Bugzilla
release, but I think it might require considerable internal changes,
though I'm not an expert; it doesn't strike me as something simple to
patch in.
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On 04/01/2010 12:59 AM, Adam Williamson wrote:
>
> As I said in another mail, Launchpad isn't better in all respects, it's
> not a simple decision. Also, currently Bugzilla is shared with Red Hat
> and hence benefits from management by dkl and other RH staff;

On the other hand, none of the bugzilla changes from Red Hat seems to be
published anywhere and other than a small number of people inside Red
Hat, we can't as a community make changes and even if we can, there are
a number of places where there is a conflict between RHEL workflows and
Fedora's. We cannot continuously avoid facing that question. Even with
the additional maintenance burden on the part of Fedora infrastructure
team, we have opted to separate things over time c.f. build systems,
mailing lists et all. The only major thing left is bugzilla.

> I doubt RH
> would switch from Bugzilla, so if Fedora wanted to adopt something RH
> could not use, Fedora would have to provide the person-hours to
> implement and maintain the new system.
>
> It'd be nice to have better handling for this in a future Bugzilla
> release, but I think it might require considerable internal changes,
> though I'm not an expert; it doesn't strike me as something simple to
> patch in.
>

I would suggest proposing those changes you have in mind to dkl, There
is a internal bugzilla list.

Rahul

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On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 12:29:26PM -0700, Adam Williamson wrote:

> It'd be nice to have better handling for this in a future Bugzilla
> release, but I think it might require considerable internal changes,
> though I'm not an expert; it doesn't strike me as something simple to
> patch in.

Maybe it would be enough to somehow store the information in Bugzilla,
e.g. using a flag for each supported release or some Whiteboard
Keywords, and then implement another Bugzilla Frontend that uses the
XML-RPC interface of Bugzilla to provide a Frontend that can be better
used for Fedora.

Regards
Till
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Till Maas wrote:
> Maybe it would be enough to somehow store the information in Bugzilla,
> e.g. using a flag for each supported release or some Whiteboard
> Keywords, and then implement another Bugzilla Frontend that uses the
> XML-RPC interface of Bugzilla to provide a Frontend that can be better
> used for Fedora.

*ding* *ding* *ding* Correct.

Check out a Firefox or Thunderbird BZ flags for a good example. Properly
adding some Fedora flags should not affect RHEL.
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On Wed, 2010-03-31 at 14:56 -0500, Michael Cronenworth wrote:
> Till Maas wrote:
> > Maybe it would be enough to somehow store the information in Bugzilla,
> > e.g. using a flag for each supported release or some Whiteboard
> > Keywords, and then implement another Bugzilla Frontend that uses the
> > XML-RPC interface of Bugzilla to provide a Frontend that can be better
> > used for Fedora.
>
> *ding* *ding* *ding* Correct.
>
> Check out a Firefox or Thunderbird BZ flags for a good example. Properly
> adding some Fedora flags should not affect RHEL.

This still smells like a messy workaround to me. Not only the web
interface is used to access Bugzilla. We'd have to patch everything else
- python-bugzilla, Fedora Community, etc - to properly 'interpret' the
flags. But hey, it'd be better than nothing, if someone wants to do the
work...
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On Thu, 2010-04-01 at 01:12 +0530, Rahul Sundaram wrote:

> I would suggest proposing those changes you have in mind to dkl, There
> is a internal bugzilla list.

The problem is this isn't an area where I can be terribly constructive;
I can point at the problem but I've nothing to offer in the way of a
solution, as I'm not a coder, nor a Bugzilla architect. I can draw
pie-in-the-sky pictures of Teh Awesome Bugtracking System, if you like,
but I've no real idea how they map to the realities of what's achievable
within the constraints of Bugzilla. Remember RH now has a policy of
diverging as little as possible from upstream Bugzilla, so any changes
we wanted to make would need to be something that upstream would accept,
we can't do significant modifications of Bugzilla purely in the RH
instance.
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On Wed, 31 Mar 2010 19:15:30 +0300 (EEST), Juha wrote:

>
>
> On Wed, 31 Mar 2010, Jeff Spaleta wrote:
> > Unfortunately our ticketing tool doesn't do a great job at this, as we
> > can't take one ticket and mark multiple release branches it affects
> > and which of those release branches the fix is provided.
>
> that's why there is 'clone' functionality. Use it.
>
>
> Tuju

Why would I want to clone a bz ticket if I did not want to fix the
bug in anything other than Rawhide?

It may even be that the reported issue can only be fixed in Rawhide while
fixing it in older software included with stable dist releases would
require unreasonable effort.
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On Wed, 31 Mar 2010, Michael Schwendt wrote:
> Why would I want to clone a bz ticket if I did not want to fix the
> bug in anything other than Rawhide?

Because it's a database of release's bugs, not a todo list?

I could be wrong of course, please correct me if I am. Considering
that existing and remaining bugs are closed (when reported upstream)
thou suggest that it actually is a todo list.

I always thought that the bugzilla is for whole community, including
the users. Not just for pkg maintainers.


Tuju

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On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 12:30 PM, Juha Tuomala <Juha.Tuomala@iki.fi> wrote:
> Because it's a database of release's bugs, not a todo list?

Bugzilla has multiple uses. The upstream project goes to some length
describing it as a flexible tool. We in fact use it for multiple
purposes. We use it for package review tickets...which are stictly
speaking not "bugs" in a release. We most definitely use it primarily
as a to-do list manager for package maintainers..from package birth to
package death. The established workflow that we are using now is not
and has never pretended to be an accurate audit trail of active
defects in a given release.

> I always thought that the bugzilla is for whole community, including
> the users. Not just for pkg maintainers.

No one has so far defined a workflow that requires an accurate audit
of active deficiencies in any release. Closing bugs fixed rawhide
certainly cause some annoyances because closed bugs are marginally
harder to search for (because you have to request closed bugs to
search through) when encountering the problem again and subsequently
cause bugs to be refiled unnecessarily. The same goes for any closure
condition that bodhi doesn't automatically perform when an update gets
pushed to stable.

-jef
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On 2010/03/31 21:47 (GMT+0200) Till Maas composed:

> On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 12:29:26PM -0700, Adam Williamson wrote:

>> It'd be nice to have better handling for this in a future Bugzilla
>> release, but I think it might require considerable internal changes,
>> though I'm not an expert; it doesn't strike me as something simple to
>> patch in.

> Maybe it would be enough to somehow store the information in Bugzilla,
> e.g. using a flag for each supported release or some Whiteboard
> Keywords, and then implement another Bugzilla Frontend that uses the
> XML-RPC interface of Bugzilla to provide a Frontend that can be better
> used for Fedora.

Bugzilla is OSS. Those with the talent and inclination to do so could try
lending a hand to existing efforts to improve branch/release handling:
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=55970

I found that bug quickly by searching in comments for string "launchpad" in
product "Bugzilla": http://tinyurl.com/yl5pkdz
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