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Old 01-02-2008, 09:01 AM
Marcela Maslanova
 
Default heads up: tcl and tk 8.5

New tcl and tk 8.5 was released. I'd like to push it to rawhide as soon
as possible. The list of dependent packages could be found in this
draft: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/MarcelaMaslanova/Draft/tcl8.5
The maintainers of dependent packages should fix them according to
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/PackagingDrafts/Tcl


Marcela Maslanova

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Old 01-02-2008, 04:22 PM
Kevin Fenzi
 
Default heads up: tcl and tk 8.5

On Wed, 02 Jan 2008 11:01:20 +0100
mmaslano@redhat.com (Marcela Maslanova) wrote:

> New tcl and tk 8.5 was released. I'd like to push it to rawhide as
> soon as possible. The list of dependent packages could be found in
> this draft:
> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/MarcelaMaslanova/Draft/tcl8.5 The
> maintainers of dependent packages should fix them according to
> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/PackagingDrafts/Tcl

Can you possibly mail directly at least the primary maintainers of
these packages and let them know when you are going to push the update?

Many of them might not see this post...

>
> Marcela Maslanova
>

kevin
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Old 01-02-2008, 05:20 PM
Michael Thomas
 
Default heads up: tcl and tk 8.5

Marcela Maslanova wrote:
> New tcl and tk 8.5 was released. I'd like to push it to rawhide as soon
> as possible. The list of dependent packages could be found in this
> draft: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/MarcelaMaslanova/Draft/tcl8.5
> The maintainers of dependent packages should fix them according to
> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/PackagingDrafts/Tcl

One of the changes that packagers need to be aware of (also described in
the proposed Tcl packaging guidelines) is that we are adding a patch to
Tcl/Tk 8.5 to limit the directories where extensions can be installed.
Currently Tcl allows extensions to be installed in /usr/lib and
/usr/lib64, and will perform a time-consuming search through all
subdirectories to find extensions.

The 'restricted auto_path' patch that we are adding will limit the
search to %{_libdir}/tcl8.5 and %{_datadir}/tcl8.5. This greatly
improves the startup time for most Tcl applications. However, it does
require that maintainers of Tcl extension packages make some changes to
ensure that the extensions get installed into %{_libdir}/tcl8.5 (or
%{_datadir}/tcl8.5) instead of %{_libdir} (or %{_datadir}). I will be
happy to help out any maintainers that want help with this change.

--Wart

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Old 01-02-2008, 09:39 PM
Michael Thomas
 
Default heads up: tcl and tk 8.5

John Ellson wrote:
>> The 'restricted auto_path' patch that we are adding will limit the
>> search to %{_libdir}/tcl8.5 and %{_datadir}/tcl8.5. This greatly
>> improves the startup time for most Tcl applications. However, it does
>> require that maintainers of Tcl extension packages make some changes to
>> ensure that the extensions get installed into %{_libdir}/tcl8.5 (or
>> %{_datadir}/tcl8.5) instead of %{_libdir} (or %{_datadir}). I will be
>> happy to help out any maintainers that want help with this change.
>
>
> Will this information be available from some kind of introspection from
> running tclsh ?

Yes. You can start tclsh and run 'set auto_path'. This will print out
a list of the directories that will be searched for packages.

> Has this change been accepted upstream so that it can be relied on on
> other platforms?

I had a discussion with upstream about this, and they blamed the problem
on the distributions installing Tcl and the extensions into too-generic
directories. Unfortunately, most extensions were developed to be
installed directly into /usr/lib and /usr/share, and now need to be
patched to be installed elsewhere.

In any case, you can always look at the contents of the auto_path
variable on any platform in Tcl to see where extensions are looked for.

--Mike

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Old 01-02-2008, 10:00 PM
Michael Thomas
 
Default heads up: tcl and tk 8.5

John Ellson wrote:
> Michael Thomas wrote:
>> John Ellson wrote:
>>
>>>> The 'restricted auto_path' patch that we are adding will limit the
>>>> search to %{_libdir}/tcl8.5 and %{_datadir}/tcl8.5. This greatly
>>>> improves the startup time for most Tcl applications. However, it does
>>>> require that maintainers of Tcl extension packages make some changes to
>>>> ensure that the extensions get installed into %{_libdir}/tcl8.5 (or
>>>> %{_datadir}/tcl8.5) instead of %{_libdir} (or %{_datadir}). I will be
>>>> happy to help out any maintainers that want help with this change.
>>>>
>>> Will this information be available from some kind of introspection from
>>> running tclsh ?
>>>
>>
>> Yes. You can start tclsh and run 'set auto_path'. This will print out
>> a list of the directories that will be searched for packages.
>>
>>
>>> Has this change been accepted upstream so that it can be relied on on
>>> other platforms?
>>>
>>
>> I had a discussion with upstream about this, and they blamed the problem
>> on the distributions installing Tcl and the extensions into too-generic
>> directories. Unfortunately, most extensions were developed to be
>> installed directly into /usr/lib and /usr/share, and now need to be
>> patched to be installed elsewhere.
>>
>> In any case, you can always look at the contents of the auto_path
>> variable on any platform in Tcl to see where extensions are looked for.
>>
>> --Mike
>>
>>
> A bit more clarification please.
>
> This is not about where to look, its about where to install, so it must
> resolve to a single value.

In that case, no, there is no introspection in Tcl to get this
information. This is because the choice of the directory in which to
install depends on whether you are installing an arch-specific or a
noarch package. But the rule is simple:

noarch packages should get installed into
%{_datadir}/tcl8.5/%{name}-%{version}

arch-specific packages should get installed into
%{_libdir}/tcl8.5/%{name}-%{version}

The proposed Tcl packaging guidelines[1] have some scriptlets that you
can use at the top of your spec file to set the installation directory:

%{!?tcl_version: %define tcl_version %(echo 'puts $tcl_version' | tclsh)}
%{!?tcl_sitelib: %define tcl_sitelib %{_datadir}/tcl%{tcl_version}}
%{!?tcl_sitearch: %define tcl_sitearch %{_libdir}/tcl%{tcl_version}}

Use %{tcl_sitearch} as the base directory for arch-specific packages,
and %{tcl_sitelib} for noarch packages.

> Using a vanilla upstream build of tcl8.5 I get:
> % set auto_path
> /usr/local/lib/tcl8.5 /usr/local/lib
>
> Should I always install in the first member of the list? (which would
> be /usr/lib/tcl8.5 normally)
>
> And under that, I presumably install in a package-specific subdirectory?
> Such as: /usr/lib/tcl8.5/graphviz/

Correct. You could add %{version} to the package-specific subdirectory
name so that it's possible to have multiple versions installed at the
same time, but that's not a requirement.

--Wart
[1] http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/PackagingDrafts/Tcl

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Old 01-02-2008, 10:29 PM
Michael Thomas
 
Default heads up: tcl and tk 8.5

John Ellson wrote:
> Michael Thomas wrote:
>> John Ellson wrote:
>>
>>> Michael Thomas wrote:
>>>
>>>> John Ellson wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> The 'restricted auto_path' patch that we are adding will limit the
>>>>>> search to %{_libdir}/tcl8.5 and %{_datadir}/tcl8.5. This greatly
>>>>>> improves the startup time for most Tcl applications. However, it
>>>>>> does
>>>>>> require that maintainers of Tcl extension packages make some
>>>>>> changes to
>>>>>> ensure that the extensions get installed into %{_libdir}/tcl8.5 (or
>>>>>> %{_datadir}/tcl8.5) instead of %{_libdir} (or %{_datadir}). I
>>>>>> will be
>>>>>> happy to help out any maintainers that want help with this change.
>>>>>>
>>>>> Will this information be available from some kind of introspection
>>>>> from
>>>>> running tclsh ?
>>>>>
>>>> Yes. You can start tclsh and run 'set auto_path'. This will print out
>>>> a list of the directories that will be searched for packages.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Has this change been accepted upstream so that it can be relied on on
>>>>> other platforms?
>>>>>
>>>> I had a discussion with upstream about this, and they blamed the
>>>> problem
>>>> on the distributions installing Tcl and the extensions into too-generic
>>>> directories. Unfortunately, most extensions were developed to be
>>>> installed directly into /usr/lib and /usr/share, and now need to be
>>>> patched to be installed elsewhere.
>>>>
>>>> In any case, you can always look at the contents of the auto_path
>>>> variable on any platform in Tcl to see where extensions are looked for.
>>>>
>>>> --Mike
>>>>
>>>>
>>> A bit more clarification please.
>>>
>>> This is not about where to look, its about where to install, so it must
>>> resolve to a single value.
>>>
>>
>> In that case, no, there is no introspection in Tcl to get this
>> information. This is because the choice of the directory in which to
>> install depends on whether you are installing an arch-specific or a
>> noarch package. But the rule is simple:
>>
>> noarch packages should get installed into
>> %{_datadir}/tcl8.5/%{name}-%{version}
>>
>> arch-specific packages should get installed into
>> %{_libdir}/tcl8.5/%{name}-%{version}
>>
>> The proposed Tcl packaging guidelines[1] have some scriptlets that you
>> can use at the top of your spec file to set the installation directory:
>>
>> %{!?tcl_version: %define tcl_version %(echo 'puts $tcl_version' | tclsh)}
>> %{!?tcl_sitelib: %define tcl_sitelib %{_datadir}/tcl%{tcl_version}}
>> %{!?tcl_sitearch: %define tcl_sitearch %{_libdir}/tcl%{tcl_version}}
>>
>> Use %{tcl_sitearch} as the base directory for arch-specific packages,
>> and %{tcl_sitelib} for noarch packages.
>>
>>
>>> Using a vanilla upstream build of tcl8.5 I get:
>>> % set auto_path
>>> /usr/local/lib/tcl8.5 /usr/local/lib
>>>
>>> Should I always install in the first member of the list? (which would
>>> be /usr/lib/tcl8.5 normally)
>>>
>>> And under that, I presumably install in a package-specific subdirectory?
>>> Such as: /usr/lib/tcl8.5/graphviz/
>>>
>>
>> Correct. You could add %{version} to the package-specific subdirectory
>> name so that it's possible to have multiple versions installed at the
>> same time, but that's not a requirement.
>>
>> --Wart
>> [1] http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/PackagingDrafts/Tcl
>>
>>
>
> Will tclConfig.sh remain in %{_libdir}/tclConfig.sh, or will it now be
> in %{_libdir}/tclsh8.5/tclConfig.sh ?
>
> (I think some other distros must do this already, since I already test
> for this in graphviz.)

tclConfig.sh will remain in %{_libdir}/tclConfig.sh.

--Wart

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Old 01-03-2008, 10:04 AM
Marcela Maslanova
 
Default heads up: tcl and tk 8.5

Kevin Fenzi wrote:

On Wed, 02 Jan 2008 11:01:20 +0100
mmaslano@redhat.com (Marcela Maslanova) wrote:



New tcl and tk 8.5 was released. I'd like to push it to rawhide as
soon as possible. The list of dependent packages could be found in
this draft:
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/MarcelaMaslanova/Draft/tcl8.5 The
maintainers of dependent packages should fix them according to
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/PackagingDrafts/Tcl



Can you possibly mail directly at least the primary maintainers of
these packages and let them know when you are going to push the update?


Who are the primary maintainers? I look at the list of maintainers and
most packages owns wart, who is helping me with

new tcl.
The tcl8.5 is already in devel repository.

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Old 01-05-2008, 01:14 PM
Alex Lancaster
 
Default heads up: tcl and tk 8.5

>>>>> "KF" == Kevin Fenzi writes:

KF> On Wed, 02 Jan 2008 11:01:20 +0100
KF> mmaslano@redhat.com (Marcela Maslanova) wrote:

> New tcl and tk 8.5 was released. I'd like to push it to rawhide as
>> soon as possible. The list of dependent packages could be found in
>> this draft:
>> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/MarcelaMaslanova/Draft/tcl8.5 The
>> maintainers of dependent packages should fix them according to
>> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/PackagingDrafts/Tcl

KF> Can you possibly mail directly at least the primary maintainers of
KF> these packages and let them know when you are going to push the
KF> update?

KF> Many of them might not see this post...

Marcela,

Can you also post to fedora-devel-announce to get wider distribution?
Judging by the high number of broken deps still in rawhide caused by
this tcl soname bump, I suspect that many maintainers may not have
seen this announcement. Many only subscribe to the -announce list and
not devel-list to avoid the high traffic here. (These kind of
distro-wide soname bumps that affect many packages should always be
posted to fedora-announce).

Also, I've noticed that several packages don't rebuild with the new
Tcl and have build failures with the following:

/usr/include/tcl-private/generic/tclPort.h:27:28: error: tclUnixPort.h: No such file or directory

(one example full log is here:
http://koji.fedoraproject.org/koji/getfile?taskID=326763&name=build.log)

is there any easy fix?

Alex

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Old 01-05-2008, 08:30 PM
Wart
 
Default heads up: tcl and tk 8.5

Alex Lancaster wrote:
>>>>>> "KF" == Kevin Fenzi writes:
>
> KF> On Wed, 02 Jan 2008 11:01:20 +0100
> KF> mmaslano@redhat.com (Marcela Maslanova) wrote:
>
>> New tcl and tk 8.5 was released. I'd like to push it to rawhide as
>>> soon as possible. The list of dependent packages could be found in
>>> this draft:
>>> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/MarcelaMaslanova/Draft/tcl8.5 The
>>> maintainers of dependent packages should fix them according to
>>> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/PackagingDrafts/Tcl
>
> KF> Can you possibly mail directly at least the primary maintainers of
> KF> these packages and let them know when you are going to push the
> KF> update?
>
> KF> Many of them might not see this post...
>
> Marcela,
>
> Can you also post to fedora-devel-announce to get wider distribution?
> Judging by the high number of broken deps still in rawhide caused by
> this tcl soname bump, I suspect that many maintainers may not have
> seen this announcement. Many only subscribe to the -announce list and
> not devel-list to avoid the high traffic here. (These kind of
> distro-wide soname bumps that affect many packages should always be
> posted to fedora-announce).
>
> Also, I've noticed that several packages don't rebuild with the new
> Tcl and have build failures with the following:
>
> /usr/include/tcl-private/generic/tclPort.h:27:28: error: tclUnixPort.h: No such file or directory
>
> (one example full log is here:
> http://koji.fedoraproject.org/koji/getfile?taskID=326763&name=build.log)
>
> is there any easy fix?

"-I/usr/include/tcl-private/unix" is missing from the compile line. The
tcl-devel package should probably make symlinks from the files in
%{_includedir}/tcl-private/unix/*.h to
%{_includedir}/tcl-private/generic/ so that the extensions don't notice
that the headers moved to a different subdirectory.

--Mike

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Old 01-07-2008, 10:34 AM
Marcela Maslanova
 
Default heads up: tcl and tk 8.5

Alex Lancaster wrote:

"KF" == Kevin Fenzi writes:



KF> On Wed, 02 Jan 2008 11:01:20 +0100
KF> mmaslano@redhat.com (Marcela Maslanova) wrote:



New tcl and tk 8.5 was released. I'd like to push it to rawhide as


soon as possible. The list of dependent packages could be found in
this draft:
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/MarcelaMaslanova/Draft/tcl8.5 The
maintainers of dependent packages should fix them according to
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/PackagingDrafts/Tcl



KF> Can you possibly mail directly at least the primary maintainers of
KF> these packages and let them know when you are going to push the
KF> update?

KF> Many of them might not see this post...

Marcela,

Can you also post to fedora-devel-announce to get wider distribution?
Judging by the high number of broken deps still in rawhide caused by
this tcl soname bump, I suspect that many maintainers may not have
seen this announcement. Many only subscribe to the -announce list and
not devel-list to avoid the high traffic here. (These kind of
distro-wide soname bumps that affect many packages should always be
posted to fedora-announce).

Also, I've noticed that several packages don't rebuild with the new
Tcl and have build failures with the following:

/usr/include/tcl-private/generic/tclPort.h:27:28: error: tclUnixPort.h: No such file or directory

(one example full log is here:
http://koji.fedoraproject.org/koji/getfile?taskID=326763&name=build.log)

is there any easy fix?

Alex


Today I rebuilt tcl with patches, which fixes this issue as I hope.
Please let me know, if your problem persists.


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