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Old 11-21-2008, 02:00 PM
sean darcy
 
Default where's the wish list for F11?

Nicolas Mailhot wrote:

Le vendredi 21 novembre 2008 à 12:28 +0100, Dominik 'Rathann'
Mierzejewski a écrit :

On Friday, 21 November 2008 at 11:34, Nicolas Mailhot wrote:



But anyway you're invited like everyone else on the list to review,
comment on and complete the current font packaging guideline change
proposal on
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/PackagingDrafts/Fonts_packaging_automation

It looks mostly sane (I applied some grammar and punctuation fixes, I hope
you don't mind),


Thank you for the review and the fixes, I don't mind at all, quite the
contrary, you're very welcome. Please post any remarks you may have
about the packages themselves, that's where the long-term value is.


but I don't like the naming of "rpm-fonts-filesystem". This
has nothing to do with rpm itself, hence it shouldn't look like a subpackage
of rpm. Instead, I suggest "fonts-filesystem".


I fear that by the time I had written the macros, templates, specs, wiki
pages, and all, my inspiration had quite dried out. I don't like
rpm-fonts much, but I feel fonts would be too generic a name for the
base package. If anyone has great naming ideas, I'm all ears.



But can't this be done without making an rpm package ( which may or may
not raise legal issues).


I'm looking for something much simpler: I go buy/get a font; I open
fonts-filesystem/system-config-fonts/whatever ; I point it to the font (
Type1, TT, etc); and the font is installed.


Making an rpm package of the font first seems to make this more involved
than it needs to be.


sean

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Old 11-21-2008, 02:04 PM
Seth Vidal
 
Default where's the wish list for F11?

On Fri, 21 Nov 2008, sean darcy wrote:



But can't this be done without making an rpm package ( which may or may not
raise legal issues).


I'm looking for something much simpler: I go buy/get a font; I open
fonts-filesystem/system-config-fonts/whatever ; I point it to the font (
Type1, TT, etc); and the font is installed.


Making an rpm package of the font first seems to make this more involved than
it needs to be.




If you're only trying to install it on one machine it is SOMEWHAT more
complicated but it will save you the pain of recovering those files the
next time you reinstall/upgrade/etc.


-sv

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Old 11-21-2008, 03:13 PM
Nicolas Mailhot
 
Default where's the wish list for F11?

Le vendredi 21 novembre 2008 à 10:00 -0500, sean darcy a écrit :

> But can't this be done without making an rpm package ( which may or may
> not raise legal issues).

Installing anything via an rpm will be just as legal (or not) as
installing it by other means

> I'm looking for something much simpler: I go buy/get a font; I open
> fonts-filesystem/system-config-fonts/whatever ; I point it to the font (
> Type1, TT, etc); and the font is installed.

So you're asking for a font-specific installation method.
Why not add a clipart-specific one? And a templates-specific one? And a
palette-specific one?

This quickly ends up an unmanageable mess wasting the time of everyone
involved.

You already have a limited user-level font installation method for
casual users (or had, a bug is open to resurect it). Anything more
complex, such as a system-wide method needing to replicate all the work
we already do in rpm, is a waste of resources.

> Making an rpm package of the font first seems to make this more involved
> than it needs to be.

The key word here is seems. Like many other "shortcuts", trying to avoid
making an rpm will end up a lot more work unless you really know what
you're doing (which you only will after having made a few rpms).

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Old 11-21-2008, 03:22 PM
Till Maas
 
Default where's the wish list for F11?

On Fri November 21 2008, Nicolas Mailhot wrote:
> Le vendredi 21 novembre 2008 à 10:00 -0500, sean darcy a écrit :
> > But can't this be done without making an rpm package ( which may or may
> > not raise legal issues).
>
> Installing anything via an rpm will be just as legal (or not) as
> installing it by other means
>
> > I'm looking for something much simpler: I go buy/get a font; I open
> > fonts-filesystem/system-config-fonts/whatever ; I point it to the font (
> > Type1, TT, etc); and the font is installed.
>
> So you're asking for a font-specific installation method.
> Why not add a clipart-specific one? And a templates-specific one? And a
> palette-specific one?

I guess everybody would be happy if the system-config-font tool would just
create a simple rpm for the font a user points to the tool and install it via
rpm.

Regards,
Till
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Old 11-22-2008, 02:18 AM
Thomas M Steenholdt
 
Default where's the wish list for F11?

Nicolas Mailhot wrote:

Le vendredi 21 novembre 2008 à 10:00 -0500, sean darcy a écrit :

But can't this be done without making an rpm package ( which may or may
not raise legal issues).


Installing anything via an rpm will be just as legal (or not) as
installing it by other means

I'm looking for something much simpler: I go buy/get a font; I open
fonts-filesystem/system-config-fonts/whatever ; I point it to the font (
Type1, TT, etc); and the font is installed.


So you're asking for a font-specific installation method.
Why not add a clipart-specific one? And a templates-specific one? And a
palette-specific one?

This quickly ends up an unmanageable mess wasting the time of everyone
involved.

You already have a limited user-level font installation method for
casual users (or had, a bug is open to resurect it). Anything more
complex, such as a system-wide method needing to replicate all the work
we already do in rpm, is a waste of resources.

Making an rpm package of the font first seems to make this more involved
than it needs to be.


The key word here is seems. Like many other "shortcuts", trying to avoid
making an rpm will end up a lot more work unless you really know what
you're doing (which you only will after having made a few rpms).




I don't make RPMS for every wallpaper I download and intend to use on my
machine. And in my world, fonts are not too different in that respect.


Why not simply provide the default fontconfig package, with the ability
to load fonts from say "/usr/local/share/fonts" ?


People with this kind of need could simple become root and copy their
fonts into that directory and be done with it...


Why not?

/THomas





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Old 11-22-2008, 03:47 AM
Matthias Clasen
 
Default where's the wish list for F11?

On Sat, 2008-11-22 at 00:18 -0300, Thomas M Steenholdt wrote:

> Why not simply provide the default fontconfig package, with the ability
> to load fonts from say "/usr/local/share/fonts" ?
>
> People with this kind of need could simple become root and copy their
> fonts into that directory and be done with it...
>
> Why not?
>

Because it is even easier to just copy the font to ~/.fonts. No need to
become root. If you want a graphical way to do this, install
nautilus-actions, and look at http://www.grumz.net/?q=node/334


Matthias

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Old 11-22-2008, 04:03 AM
Thomas M Steenholdt
 
Default where's the wish list for F11?

Matthias Clasen wrote:

On Sat, 2008-11-22 at 00:18 -0300, Thomas M Steenholdt wrote:

Why not simply provide the default fontconfig package, with the ability
to load fonts from say "/usr/local/share/fonts" ?


People with this kind of need could simple become root and copy their
fonts into that directory and be done with it...


Why not?



Because it is even easier to just copy the font to ~/.fonts. No need to
become root. If you want a graphical way to do this, install
nautilus-actions, and look at http://www.grumz.net/?q=node/334


Matthias



I know there's been mention of graphical tools, but that's not what I'm
suggesting here.


What I'm suggesting is a system-wide equivalent of ~/.fonts.

/Thomas

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Old 11-22-2008, 07:57 AM
Nicolas Mailhot
 
Default where's the wish list for F11?

Le samedi 22 novembre 2008 à 00:18 -0300, Thomas M Steenholdt a écrit :

> I don't make RPMS for every wallpaper I download and intend to use on my
> machine. And in my world, fonts are not too different in that respect.

Please look at what our font packages actually do before stating this.

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Old 11-22-2008, 11:02 AM
Thomas M Steenholdt
 
Default where's the wish list for F11?

Nicolas Mailhot wrote:

Le samedi 22 novembre 2008 à 00:18 -0300, Thomas M Steenholdt a écrit :

I don't make RPMS for every wallpaper I download and intend to use on my
machine. And in my world, fonts are not too different in that respect.


Please look at what our font packages actually do before stating this.



This is an oppinion, not an attempt to document current behaviour.

/Thomas

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Old 11-22-2008, 05:42 PM
Roberto Ragusa
 
Default where's the wish list for F11?

Thomas M Steenholdt wrote:

> Why not simply provide the default fontconfig package, with the ability
> to load fonts from say "/usr/local/share/fonts" ?
>

Good idea.
This is exactly what I've done to add some unpackaged fonts
to my system.
A comment in /etc/fonts/fonts.conf says you should have local
modifications in /etc/fonts/local.conf.

This is the content of my local.conf:

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?>
<!DOCTYPE fontconfig SYSTEM "fonts.dtd">
<fontconfig>
<dir>/usr/local/share/fonts</dir>
</fontconfig>

Best regards.
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