One of the configuration changes made when installing Linux on Flash
media seems to be to turn on the 'reltime' mount option in fstab.
Should we perhaps turn this by default, if there are no downside to
this?

Failing that, perhaps being able to mark, when using Anaconda, which
devices are actually Flash -- or autodetect them somehow -- and use
'reltime' on those?

Regards,

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Once upon a time, Michel Salim <michel.sylvan@gmail.com> said:
> One of the configuration changes made when installing Linux on Flash
> media seems to be to turn on the 'reltime' mount option in fstab.
> Should we perhaps turn this by default, if there are no downside to
> this?

Do you mean 'relatime'? I don't see 'reltime' in the mount(8) man page.

If you mean 'relatime', I think that has been the default since (at
least) Fedora 8 for ext3 filesystems; it is set in the kernel. You have
to add 'atime' to the mount options to turn it off.

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On Thu, Sep 25, 2008 at 10:35 AM, Chris Adams <cmadams@hiwaay.net> wrote:
> Once upon a time, Michel Salim <michel.sylvan@gmail.com> said:
>> One of the configuration changes made when installing Linux on Flash
>> media seems to be to turn on the 'reltime' mount option in fstab.
>> Should we perhaps turn this by default, if there are no downside to
>> this?
>
> Do you mean 'relatime'? I don't see 'reltime' in the mount(8) man page.
>
> If you mean 'relatime', I think that has been the default since (at
> least) Fedora 8 for ext3 filesystems; it is set in the kernel. You have
> to add 'atime' to the mount options to turn it off.
>
Oops, yes. Incidentally, the manpage mispells it as 'realatime' in the
norelatime section; time to file a bug. No mention that relatime is
the default either -- does this belong in the manpage or in the
release notes?

Just noticed the Fedora Mini SIG; the wiki should probably have a page
discussing configuration options, in case anyone else incorrectly
assumes (as I did) that the default is still 'atime'.

Thanks,

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Michel Salim wrote:
> On Thu, Sep 25, 2008 at 10:35 AM, Chris Adams <cmadams@hiwaay.net> wrote:
>> Once upon a time, Michel Salim <michel.sylvan@gmail.com> said:
>>> One of the configuration changes made when installing Linux on Flash
>>> media seems to be to turn on the 'reltime' mount option in fstab.
>>> Should we perhaps turn this by default, if there are no downside to
>>> this?
>> Do you mean 'relatime'? I don't see 'reltime' in the mount(8) man page.
>>
>> If you mean 'relatime', I think that has been the default since (at
>> least) Fedora 8 for ext3 filesystems; it is set in the kernel. You have
>> to add 'atime' to the mount options to turn it off.
>>
> Oops, yes. Incidentally, the manpage mispells it as 'realatime' in the
> norelatime section; time to file a bug. No mention that relatime is
> the default either -- does this belong in the manpage or in the
> release notes?
>
> Just noticed the Fedora Mini SIG; the wiki should probably have a page
> discussing configuration options, in case anyone else incorrectly
> assumes (as I did) that the default is still 'atime'.
>
> Thanks,
>

probably release notes, since default relatime is a fedora-special, and
not upstream.

-Eric

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Once upon a time, Eric Sandeen <sandeen@redhat.com> said:
> Michel Salim wrote:
> > Oops, yes. Incidentally, the manpage mispells it as 'realatime' in the
> > norelatime section; time to file a bug. No mention that relatime is
> > the default either -- does this belong in the manpage or in the
> > release notes?
>
> probably release notes, since default relatime is a fedora-special, and
> not upstream.

I'd think that if Fedora is going to carry a custom patch to set this in
the kernel, Fedora could also carry a custom patch noting it in the
mount(8) man page.
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Chris Adams wrote:
> Once upon a time, Eric Sandeen <sandeen@redhat.com> said:
>> Michel Salim wrote:
>>> Oops, yes. Incidentally, the manpage mispells it as 'realatime' in the
>>> norelatime section; time to file a bug. No mention that relatime is
>>> the default either -- does this belong in the manpage or in the
>>> release notes?
>> probably release notes, since default relatime is a fedora-special, and
>> not upstream.
>
> I'd think that if Fedora is going to carry a custom patch to set this in
> the kernel, Fedora could also carry a custom patch noting it in the
> mount(8) man page.

ok

-Eric (who at one point was going to try to clean up that patch and get
it upstream, since the author has not done so...)

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On Thu, Sep 25, 2008 at 2:20 PM, Eric Sandeen <sandeen@redhat.com> wrote:
> Chris Adams wrote:
>> Once upon a time, Eric Sandeen <sandeen@redhat.com> said:
>>> Michel Salim wrote:
>>>> Oops, yes. Incidentally, the manpage mispells it as 'realatime' in the
>>>> norelatime section; time to file a bug. No mention that relatime is
>>>> the default either -- does this belong in the manpage or in the
>>>> release notes?
>>> probably release notes, since default relatime is a fedora-special, and
>>> not upstream.
>>
>> I'd think that if Fedora is going to carry a custom patch to set this in
>> the kernel, Fedora could also carry a custom patch noting it in the
>> mount(8) man page.
>
> ok

Sounds good; I added that request to the bug report as well:
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=463979

Thanks,

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On Thu, Sep 25, 2008 at 01:17:04PM -0500, Chris Adams wrote:
> Once upon a time, Eric Sandeen <sandeen@redhat.com> said:
> > Michel Salim wrote:
> > > Oops, yes. Incidentally, the manpage mispells it as 'realatime' in the
> > > norelatime section; time to file a bug. No mention that relatime is
> > > the default either -- does this belong in the manpage or in the
> > > release notes?
> >
> > probably release notes, since default relatime is a fedora-special, and
> > not upstream.
>
> I'd think that if Fedora is going to carry a custom patch to set this in
> the kernel, Fedora could also carry a custom patch noting it in the
> mount(8) man page.

FWIW, we don't carry that patch in the kernel any more.
Until upstream takes it, it's unlikely to come back.

Dave

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Once upon a time, Dave Jones <davej@redhat.com> said:
> FWIW, we don't carry that patch in the kernel any more.
> Until upstream takes it, it's unlikely to come back.

Ah, okay. I looked at the kernel SRPM from rawhide, and the patch is
still in there, but now I see in the spec that it is commented out.

That would be something release-note worthy IMHO, since it is a change
in behavior.

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On Thu, Sep 25, 2008 at 4:27 PM, Chris Adams <cmadams@hiwaay.net> wrote:
> Once upon a time, Dave Jones <davej@redhat.com> said:
>> FWIW, we don't carry that patch in the kernel any more.
>> Until upstream takes it, it's unlikely to come back.
>
> Ah, okay. I looked at the kernel SRPM from rawhide, and the patch is
> still in there, but now I see in the spec that it is commented out.
>
> That would be something release-note worthy IMHO, since it is a change
> in behavior.
>
It makes sense to ship as close a kernel as possible to upstream -- in
this case, should the 'relatime' be introduced in the userspace
somewhere, though? Whichever utility (anaconda? hal?) touches
/etc/fstab should add 'relatime' appropriately.

Regards
,

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