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Old 08-13-2008, 08:51 PM
"Debarshi Ray"
 
Default AWOL process for Jeff Carlson

I would like to initiate the non-responsive maintainer policy [1]
against Jeff Carlson. Jeff has not touched his packages in a long
while and one of them 'zile' [2] has missed a number of upstream
releases since then. An effort was made to contact by filing a bug
against 'zile': https://bugzilla.redhat.com/447125 However even after
subsequent reminders he did not respond. Attempts were made to contact
him over email, but it looks like his email address is also out of
order. So chances are he his not even getting the Bugzilla emails.

In the meantime a new contributor, Rakesh [3], has come forward, who
is interested in one of his packages -- zile. As the package had not
been touched by a human for quite sometime and Rakesh needed a sponsor
a review was submitted: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/449879 Since then
Rakesh has been sponsored and his review request approved.

So can we declare Jeff Carlson as AWOL and transfer ownership of
'zile' to Rakesh?

Happy hacking,
Debarshi

[1] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/PackageMaintainers/Policy/NonResponsiveMaintainers
[2] https://admin.fedoraproject.org/pkgdb/packages/name/zile
[3] https://admin.fedoraproject.org/pkgdb/users/packages/rakesh

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Old 08-13-2008, 09:10 PM
Robin Norwood
 
Default AWOL process for Jeff Carlson

On Thu, 14 Aug 2008 02:21:13 +0530
"Debarshi Ray" <debarshi.ray@gmail.com> wrote:

> So can we declare Jeff Carlson as AWOL and transfer ownership of
> 'zile' to Rakesh?

Can we not use the term 'AWOL'? I don't know Mr. Carlson at all, but I
gather his contributions to Fedora are probably entirely voluntary.
The term AWOL (Away Without Leave) implies a dereliction of duty, and
I think it is pejorative in the context of a volunteer effort. We often
hear the phrase 'real life comes first' in reference to open source
volunteerism, and this is quite possibly the case here.

For all we know, Mr. Carlson may soon return to Fedora work, and
may not appreciate being referred to as 'AWOL'.

I suspect that maybe the non-responsive maintainer policy is no
longer officially called the 'AWOL' policy for exactly this reason.

-RN

--
Robin Norwood
Red Hat, Inc.

"The Sage does nothing, yet nothing remains undone."
-Lao Tzu, Te Tao Ching

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Old 08-13-2008, 09:15 PM
Michael Schwendt
 
Default AWOL process for Jeff Carlson

On Wed, 13 Aug 2008 17:10:29 -0400, Robin Norwood wrote:

> On Thu, 14 Aug 2008 02:21:13 +0530
> "Debarshi Ray" wrote:
>
> > So can we declare Jeff Carlson as AWOL and transfer ownership of
> > 'zile' to Rakesh?
>
> Can we not use the term 'AWOL'? I don't know Mr. Carlson at all, but I
> gather his contributions to Fedora are probably entirely voluntary.
> The term AWOL (Away Without Leave) implies a dereliction of duty, and
> I think it is pejorative in the context of a volunteer effort. We often
> hear the phrase 'real life comes first' in reference to open source
> volunteerism, and this is quite possibly the case here.

My old proposal has been MIA (Missing In Action).
Better?

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Old 08-13-2008, 09:19 PM
Jason L Tibbitts III
 
Default AWOL process for Jeff Carlson

>>>>> "MS" == Michael Schwendt <mschwendt@gmail.com> writes:

MS> My old proposal has been MIA (Missing In Action). Better?

I thought we settled on the neutral "Non-responsive" some ages ago,
but we need to invoke this so rarely that I think everyone has
forgotten.

- J<

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Old 08-13-2008, 09:32 PM
Michael Schwendt
 
Default AWOL process for Jeff Carlson

On 13 Aug 2008 16:19:27 -0500, Jason L Tibbitts III wrote:

> I thought we settled on the neutral "Non-responsive" some ages ago,
> but we need to invoke this so rarely that I think everyone has
> forgotten.

Nah, see link [1] in the OP's mail in this thread.

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Old 08-13-2008, 10:42 PM
Till Maas
 
Default AWOL process for Jeff Carlson

On Wed August 13 2008, Jason L Tibbitts III wrote:
> >>>>> "MS" == Michael Schwendt <mschwendt@gmail.com> writes:
>
> MS> My old proposal has been MIA (Missing In Action). Better?
>
> I thought we settled on the neutral "Non-responsive" some ages ago,
> but we need to invoke this so rarely that I think everyone has
> forgotten.

According to the source of the policy page it was called AWOL (and this was
the name I was also remembering):

<!-- page was renamed from PackageMaintainers/Policy/AWOL Maintainers
-->
<!-- page was renamed from Extras/Policy/AWOL Maintainers
-->

Imho in case there is a renaming of an policy, the cause should be also
explained in the page. Non-native speakers may not be able to know the
reasons for such a renaming without it beeing documented. For me 'AWOL' did
not imply anything negative.

Regards,
Till
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Old 08-13-2008, 11:10 PM
Michael Schwendt
 
Default AWOL process for Jeff Carlson

On Thu, 14 Aug 2008 00:42:01 +0200, Till Maas wrote:

> Imho in case there is a renaming of an policy, the cause should be also
> explained in the page. Non-native speakers may not be able to know the
> reasons for such a renaming without it beeing documented. For me 'AWOL' did
> not imply anything negative.

Robin has tried to explain it. The negative thing about it is that its
commonly used for cases of absence _without permission_. Not just in a
military context. It's used when somebody ought not be away, and being
away would be considered a _breach of duty_.

Being "non-responsive" is not a good thing either, but its meaning
is less harsh.

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Old 08-14-2008, 11:01 AM
Nils Philippsen
 
Default AWOL process for Jeff Carlson

On Thu, 2008-08-14 at 01:10 +0200, Michael Schwendt wrote:
> On Thu, 14 Aug 2008 00:42:01 +0200, Till Maas wrote:
>
> > Imho in case there is a renaming of an policy, the cause should be also
> > explained in the page. Non-native speakers may not be able to know the
> > reasons for such a renaming without it beeing documented. For me 'AWOL' did
> > not imply anything negative.
>
> Robin has tried to explain it. The negative thing about it is that its
> commonly used for cases of absence _without permission_. Not just in a
> military context. It's used when somebody ought not be away, and being
> away would be considered a _breach of duty_.

Well, we're not in the military here, but IMO the term AWOL is fitting
insofar as you can grant your own leave rather easily by notifying the
rest of us about it. Not doing so could be considered a "breach of
duty", if you bear in mind that duty here is something different than
duty in uniform.

I don't really care about what term we use to designate non-responsive
maintainers, but it should be "harsh" enough so that people are aware of
the consequences of it.

Nils
--
Nils Philippsen "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase
Red Hat a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty
nils@redhat.com nor Safety." -- Benjamin Franklin, 1759
PGP fingerprint: C4A8 9474 5C4C ADE3 2B8F 656D 47D8 9B65 6951 3011

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Old 08-23-2008, 04:04 PM
"Rakesh Pandit"
 
Default AWOL process for Jeff Carlson

2008/8/14 Nils Philippsen <nils@redhat.com>:
[..]
> Well, we're not in the military here, but IMO the term AWOL is fitting
> insofar as you can grant your own leave rather easily by notifying the
> rest of us about it. Not doing so could be considered a "breach of
> duty", if you bear in mind that duty here is something different than
> duty in uniform.
>
> I don't really care about what term we use to designate non-responsive
> maintainers, but it should be "harsh" enough so that people are aware of
> the consequences of it.
>
[..]

This got moved to important discussion but basic question/aim for mail
remained unanswered.

My review for 2.2.61 update has been APPROVED and I am added as
co-maintainer for this package.

All steps mentioned here have been followed:
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/PackageMaintainers/Policy/NonResponsiveMaintainers

The concerned request is
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=447125 So what next ?

I suppose this needs a look by anybody from FESco members.

Thanks,

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Regards,
Rakesh Pandit

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Old 08-23-2008, 04:25 PM
"Jon Stanley"
 
Default AWOL process for Jeff Carlson

On Sat, Aug 23, 2008 at 12:04 PM, Rakesh Pandit <rakesh.pandit@gmail.com> wrote:

> I suppose this needs a look by anybody from FESco members.

FESCo has been looking at this. Me and at least one other FESCo member
believe that this maintainer is gone/no longer interested in Fedora in
this particular case. Therefore, I am approving the orphaning request,
thus the three day "no objection" period begins today.

As a side note, there is also another package affected, called
up-imapproxy. It also needs a loving owner

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