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Old 03-24-2008, 05:43 AM
 
Default RFC: Search and load drivers automatically fromusb-storage media

Hello John

comments inline.

regards,
sandeep.

-----Original Message-----
From: anaconda-devel-list-bounces@redhat.com
[mailto:anaconda-devel-list-bounces@redhat.com] On Behalf Of John
Summerfield
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 5:24 AM
To: Discussion of Development and Customization of the Red Hat Linux
Installer
Subject: Re: [ PATCH ] RFC: Search and load drivers automatically
fromusb-storage media

Sandeep_K_Shandilya@Dell.com wrote:
> Hello John
>
> That is what this patch is attempting to do, solve the problem of
> hunting for drivers on the net. This patch is changing anaconda so
> that it automagically looks for drivers in USB storage embedded inside

> the box loads and installs it. Maybe not for the old hardware that you

> already are using but for the upcoming servers.

So you have binary-only drivers?
<sandeep>
dkms rpms carry source and binaries. The binarie kernel modules could be
used at install time to recognise new hardware. Once install completes
then you could install the dkms rpms.
Here is a layout of the file system, This should make it a lot clear
now.

oemdrv/
oemdrv/megaraid_sas_dd.img
oemdrv/mptlinux_dd.img
oemdrv/abc/
oemdrv/abc/megaraid_sas_dkms.noarch.rpm
oemdrv/def/
oemdrv/def/dkms-2.0.17-1.noarch.rpm
oemdrv/hij/
oemdrv/hij/mptlinux-dkms.noarch.rpm

the *dd.img will be used at install time( this has to contain binary
kernel modules ).
The rpms contain the binaries and the source. The binaries are compiled
against the Dell supported RHEL distro. if you have a new rhel distro
the source will be installed by dkms in /usr/src/.. you could compile
the driver for your distro and use it.
infact dkms is also available in the universe section on ubuntu. dkms is
supported on many other linux distro's.

My very favourite rescue disk is Knoppix. Sometimes I have the latest on
hand, sometimes not. I am less concerned about security updates than I
am about my regular distro, so provided the CD to hand boots I'm happy
to use it. I use it for Linux and Windows systems alike - i can't do a
lot to _repair_ a broken Windows system, but it can help with cloning
it, with resizing its filesystems etc.

Debian is very picky about what it allows into its distro, and Knoppix
is based off Debian. Klaus Knopper, who created Knoppix, might not see
value in including DKMS, he has to make some sacrifices to get it all
down to a single CD.

If it doesn't work with your hardware, then I can't use my favourite
rescue CD.

If I'm running a standard RHEL or CentOS or Fedora or Debian or *SUSE
system and I have a problem, I have a well-defined path to follow to
report it and in the fullness of time to get a fix.

As I understand it, if I'm running one of your binary-only drivers, I
don't have any support. The kernel's tainted and, I've been told, the
fact of the driver's being loaded means it could have done bad things.

I recall an incident, many years ago, when RH was bitten by this very
issue, in respect of CDE that RH used to distribute with RHL. RH
couldn't fix CDE and its supplier wouldn't or wouldn't do it in the
timeframe RH required.

I'm not sure that DELL would provide full support for RHEL, or even the
kernel, on one of its servers.

And if you think I'm difficult, go to debian.org and read some of the
discussions about non-free bits in the kernel!

>


--

Cheers
John

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Old 03-24-2008, 10:39 AM
John Summerfield
 
Default RFC: Search and load drivers automatically fromusb-storage media

Sandeep_K_Shandilya@Dell.com wrote:

Hello John

comments inline.

regards,
sandeep.


-----Original Message-----
From: anaconda-devel-list-bounces@redhat.com
[mailto:anaconda-devel-list-bounces@redhat.com] On Behalf Of John
Summerfield
Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 5:24 AM
To: Discussion of Development and Customization of the Red Hat Linux
Installer
Subject: Re: [ PATCH ] RFC: Search and load drivers automatically
fromusb-storage media

Sandeep_K_Shandilya@Dell.com wrote:

Hello John

That is what this patch is attempting to do, solve the problem of
hunting for drivers on the net. This patch is changing anaconda so
that it automagically looks for drivers in USB storage embedded inside



the box loads and installs it. Maybe not for the old hardware that you



already are using but for the upcoming servers.


So you have binary-only drivers?
<sandeep>
dkms rpms carry source and binaries. The binarie kernel modules could be
used at install time to recognise new hardware. Once install completes
then you could install the dkms rpms.


I have dkms installed on one of my servers, it was pulled in when I
installed madwifi, along with a heap of other stuff including gcc. I am
not enthused at having gcc installed on a server.



Here is a layout of the file system, This should make it a lot clear
now.

oemdrv/
oemdrv/megaraid_sas_dd.img
oemdrv/mptlinux_dd.img
oemdrv/abc/
oemdrv/abc/megaraid_sas_dkms.noarch.rpm
oemdrv/def/
oemdrv/def/dkms-2.0.17-1.noarch.rpm
oemdrv/hij/
oemdrv/hij/mptlinux-dkms.noarch.rpm

the *dd.img will be used at install time( this has to contain binary
kernel modules ).
The rpms contain the binaries and the source. The binaries are compiled
against the Dell supported RHEL distro. if you have a new rhel distro
the source will be installed by dkms in /usr/src/.. you could compile
the driver for your distro and use it.
infact dkms is also available in the universe section on ubuntu. dkms is
supported on many other linux distro's.



It is not clear to me that you have answered my question. When I use the
term "binary-only drivers," I mean drivers for which Dell does not
willingly provide source.


Is there any part of the Dell drivers for which a customer cannot get
the source under an OSI-approved licence, preferably GPL2 or later?


I might want to run RHEL, I might prefer CentOS or even Fedora, all of
with Anaconda supports, or I might even prefer a distro which Anaconda
does not support such as Debian, and I may not care whether it's
_certified_ on my platform provided that there's a reasonable
probability that it will work and that my hardware vendor won't be too
harsh if there's a problem.


_I_ do in fact run all the distros I've just mentioned, and more.

If Dell wants to be difficult about the source code to its drivers, and
any of other vendors such as Sun, HP and IBM does provide source and
help should I have problems with non-certified hardware, the Dell is
batting on a very sticky wicket.





My very favourite rescue disk is Knoppix. Sometimes I have the latest on
hand, sometimes not. I am less concerned about security updates than I
am about my regular distro, so provided the CD to hand boots I'm happy
to use it. I use it for Linux and Windows systems alike - i can't do a
lot to _repair_ a broken Windows system, but it can help with cloning
it, with resizing its filesystems etc.

Debian is very picky about what it allows into its distro, and Knoppix
is based off Debian. Klaus Knopper, who created Knoppix, might not see
value in including DKMS, he has to make some sacrifices to get it all
down to a single CD.

If it doesn't work with your hardware, then I can't use my favourite
rescue CD.

If I'm running a standard RHEL or CentOS or Fedora or Debian or *SUSE
system and I have a problem, I have a well-defined path to follow to
report it and in the fullness of time to get a fix.

As I understand it, if I'm running one of your binary-only drivers, I
don't have any support. The kernel's tainted and, I've been told, the
fact of the driver's being loaded means it could have done bad things.

I recall an incident, many years ago, when RH was bitten by this very
issue, in respect of CDE that RH used to distribute with RHL. RH
couldn't fix CDE and its supplier wouldn't or wouldn't do it in the
timeframe RH required.

I'm not sure that DELL would provide full support for RHEL, or even the
kernel, on one of its servers.

And if you think I'm difficult, go to debian.org and read some of the
discussions about non-free bits in the kernel!






--

Cheers
John

-- spambait
1aaaaaaa@coco.merseine.nu Z1aaaaaaa@coco.merseine.nu
-- Advice
http://webfoot.com/advice/email.top.php
http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/555375

You cannot reply off-list:-)

_______________________________________________
Anaconda-devel-list mailing list
Anaconda-devel-list@redhat.com
https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/anaconda-devel-list
 

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