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Old 09-07-2012, 08:20 AM
Matt Johnson
 
Default Desktop choice/performance

We are running LTSP on Ubuntu 10.04 across 64 workstations distributed across 8 classrooms and in one computer suite in a school in Hertfordshire, UK.

We are beginning to plan for our move to a fresh install of Edubuntu 12.04. I note that the Edubuntu screenshots page shows Unity, which we are keen to deploy, and then the more traditional desktop 'fallback' which is says is more suited to LTSP environments. This implies a performance hit for running Unity (2d?) in LTSP environments.

What are folks' experiences of running Unity (2d?) versus the fallback mode in an LTSP deployment? Have people experienced a performance hit from moving from Gnome 2 on 10.04 to Unity 2d on 12.04?*Realistically, should we expect to be running fallback mode to achieve a*similar*level of performance to our current install?

Thanks in advance.

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Old 09-07-2012, 10:14 AM
 
Default Desktop choice/performance

> What are folks' experiences of running Unity (2d?) versus the fallback
> mode in an LTSP deployment? Have people experienced a performance hit from
> moving from Gnome 2 on 10.04 to Unity 2d on 12.04?*Realistically, should
> we expect to be running fallback mode to achieve a*similar*level of
> performance to our current install?

I think is is not question about desktop environment (Unity 3D vs.
LXDE/XFCE) but question about thin vs. fat client. You should go for fat
client, if your desktop hardaware can do that. Fat client gives to you the
best desktop performance whatever desktop you are using, even KDE can fly
in fat client.

Test Alkis' ltsp-pnp (coming to 12.10), if your network environment and
needs are simple enough. It is awesome. I use it with Lubuntu. My PCs are
very basic ones: P4/NVidia Vanta/512M(emory).

If you can't go for fat client, then you have to test amd tweak and ask
what users are thinking.

So, I recommend something like Lubuntu/Xubuntu+ltsp-pnp/fat client. It
gives best performane with media support (audio, video, voip etc).

https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ltsp-pnp
http://wiki.lxde.org/en/Comparision_between_LXDE_and_Xfce
http://jonathancarter.org/2010/11/24/how-do-ltsp-fat-clients-work/

Best Regards Asmo Koskinen.


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Old 09-07-2012, 12:37 PM
"David Trask"
 
Default Desktop choice/performance

I'll add that I am running 12.04....using the fallback desktop. *My choice was more for the users and less about performance. *Unity is SO different from all the other desktops in the school, I was worried that the little ones (we're grades K-8) would have some difficulty. *Asmo made some comments about going with Fat clients if you can...and while I agree, I went with a
different route. *I have thin-clients (that are capable of being Fat clients....Dell Optiplex G620's Ultra-Small form factor with 1 GB ram...etc.) yet I'm choosing to run most of my memory and processor intensive applications such as web browsers and Flash....Celestia...Google Earth...etc. as local-apps. *I'm used to the thin-client model and wanted to keep it simple yeat reap the benefits of using the local machine processor and ram. *I must say....it's working GREAT! *My own lab has 26 clients....and we had a room full of young kids watching smooth streaming video the other day....full screen! *I taught a lesson the other day with Google Earth! *(it's pretty cool because these are thin-clients...running local-apps) *We've been running LTSP in some form here since 2001....the kids are used to it and this year...they are truly impressed with the smoothness and speed. *


Kudos to the Epoptes folks as well. *Epoptes ROCKS! *I have more control than ever now! *Aside from the usual controlling screens, demoing, boradcasting, and so forth....I now have wake-on-lan and shutdown control....for my whole building! *Things are running very smoothly. *I've even incorporated scripts to allow me to switch my lab from auto-login back to normal login.




Matt Johnson <johnsonmlw@yahoo.com> writes:
We are running LTSP on Ubuntu 10.04 across 64 workstations distributed across 8 classrooms and in one computer suite in a school in Hertfordshire, UK.


We are beginning to plan for our move to a fresh install of Edubuntu 12.04. I note that the Edubuntu screenshots page shows Unity, which we are keen to deploy, and then the more traditional desktop 'fallback' which is says is more suited to LTSP environments. This implies a performance hit for running Unity (2d?) in LTSP environments.


What are folks' experiences of running Unity (2d?) versus the fallback mode in an LTSP deployment? Have people experienced a performance hit from moving from Gnome 2 on 10.04 to Unity 2d on 12.04?*Realistically, should we expect to be running fallback mode to achieve a*similar*level of performance to our current install?


Thanks in advance.


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Matt


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David Trask
Technology Director/Teacher
Vassalboro Community School
dtrask@vcsvikings.org
(207) 923-4305




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Old 09-07-2012, 12:44 PM
David Groos
 
Default Desktop choice/performance

I'm hoping to continue soon with transitioning from 10.04 to 12.04 also.* I'm using 10.04 fat clients and am happy.* I am working to use ltsp-pnp and am wondering how/if that works with 2 NIC's since the recommended/described setup is with 1 NIC running a DNS.* I'm working in a windows network and am required to make my Ubuntu labs on an isolated sub-net.* Any recommendations on this aspect?


Thanks,
David

On Fri, Sep 7, 2012 at 5:14 AM, <asmo.koskinen@arkki.info> wrote:



> What are folks' experiences of running Unity (2d?) versus the fallback

> mode in an LTSP deployment? Have people experienced a performance hit from

> moving from Gnome 2 on 10.04 to Unity 2d on 12.04?*Realistically, should

> we expect to be running fallback mode to achieve a*similar*level of

> performance to our current install?



I think is is not question about desktop environment (Unity 3D vs.

LXDE/XFCE) but question about thin vs. fat client. You should go for fat

client, if your desktop hardaware can do that. Fat client gives to you the

best desktop performance whatever desktop you are using, even KDE can fly

in fat client.



Test Alkis' ltsp-pnp (coming to 12.10), if your network environment and

needs are simple enough. It is awesome. I use it with Lubuntu. My PCs are

very basic ones: P4/NVidia Vanta/512M(emory).



If you can't go for fat client, then you have to test amd tweak and ask

what users are thinking.



So, I recommend something like Lubuntu/Xubuntu+ltsp-pnp/fat client. It

gives best performane with media support (audio, video, voip etc).



https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ltsp-pnp

http://wiki.lxde.org/en/Comparision_between_LXDE_and_Xfce

http://jonathancarter.org/2010/11/24/how-do-ltsp-fat-clients-work/



Best Regards Asmo Koskinen.





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Old 09-07-2012, 12:54 PM
Alkis Georgopoulos
 
Default Desktop choice/performance

Στις 07/09/2012 03:44 μμ, ο/η David Groos *γραψε:
> I'm hoping to continue soon with transitioning from 10.04 to 12.04
> also. I'm using 10.04 fat clients and am happy. I am working to use
> ltsp-pnp and am wondering how/if that works with 2 NIC's since the
> recommended/described setup is with 1 NIC running a DNS. I'm working in
> a windows network and am required to make my Ubuntu labs on an isolated
> sub-net. Any recommendations on this aspect?


ltsp-pnp doesn't have a problem with how many NICs you have or how you
have them connected;
it's just the wiki page that assumes a single NIC setup.

https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ltsp-pnp

You can use either dnsmasq or isc-dhcp-server, whichever one you like.
If you use dnsmasq, just configure the internal IP of the server to
192.168.67.1

If you prefer to use isc-dhcp, avoid the dnsmasq-specific things in the
wiki, like `ltsp-config dnsmasq`, IPAPPEND 3 etc.


If you don't manage to configure your 2-nic setup, tell me to add a
section in the wiki for that case. If you do, add it yourself.

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Old 09-07-2012, 02:17 PM
Matt Johnson
 
Default Desktop choice/performance

>________________________________
> From: "asmo.koskinen@arkki.info" <asmo.koskinen@arkki.info>
>To: Matt Johnson <johnsonmlw@yahoo.com>
>Cc: "edubuntu-users@lists.ubuntu.com" <edubuntu-users@lists.ubuntu.com>
>Sent: Friday, 7 September 2012, 11:14
>Subject: Re: Desktop choice/performance
>
>
>> What are folks' experiences of running Unity (2d?) versus the fallback
>> mode in an LTSP deployment? Have people experienced a performance hit from
>> moving from Gnome 2 on 10.04 to Unity 2d on 12.04?*Realistically, should
>> we expect to be running fallback mode to achieve a*similar*level of
>> performance to our current install?
>
>I think is is not question about desktop environment (Unity 3D vs.
>LXDE/XFCE) but question about thin vs. fat client. You should go for fat
>client, if your desktop hardaware can do that. Fat client gives to you the
>best desktop performance whatever desktop you are using, even KDE can fly
>in fat client.

Hi there,

Thanks for taking the time to post the links etc. I will look at the alternative install through ltsp-pnp, but will probably wait for it to hit 12.10. Like David on this list, we use local apps effectively across the 64 clients. I too am suitably impressed and*amazed*at how slick that is. We plan to*branch*out into fat clients in this new move to 12.04 as some workstations will handle that*admirably.

My question really is about desktops - i.e. what people have found in terms of performance moving from 10.04 Gnome 2 to 12.04 Unity 2d using the same clients and server. I guess it doesn't really matter, as if there is a drop in performance, we can use 'fallback' (which I believe is still Gnome?) as described.

Thanks all, and thanks for all the hard work to make this such an exciting and impressive option for schools.

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Old 09-07-2012, 02:20 PM
Matt Johnson
 
Default Desktop choice/performance

>________________________________
> From: David Trask <dtrask@vcsvikings.org>
>To: johnsonmlw@yahoo.com
>Cc: edubuntu-users@lists.ubuntu.com
>Sent: Friday, 7 September 2012, 13:37
>Subject: Re: Desktop choice/performance
>
>
>**

>Kudos to the Epoptes folks as well. *Epoptes ROCKS! *I have more control than ever now! *Aside from the usual controlling screens, demoing, boradcasting, and so forth....I now have wake-on-lan and shutdown control....for my whole building! *Things are running very smoothly. *I've even incorporated scripts to allow me to switch my lab from auto-login back to normal login.

I've yet to try Epoptes. I'll have a look at it as part of the new moves to 12.04.

Thanks.

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Old 09-07-2012, 02:38 PM
John Hupp
 
Default Desktop choice/performance

I read https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ltsp-pnp
and saw that it supports thin and fat clients, does not use a
chroot, and prefers a single-NIC setup.* Nice.



But I didn't see anything there that gave any indication about
client performance when comparing LTSP-PNP vs. the current version
of LTSP5 in 12.04.* I am especially interested in thin (very thin)
client performance.



Anyone?



On 9/7/2012 6:14 AM,
asmo.koskinen@arkki.info wrote:



What are folks' experiences of running Unity (2d?) versus the fallback
mode in an LTSP deployment? Have people experienced a performance hit from
moving from Gnome 2 on 10.04 to Unity 2d on 12.04?*Realistically, should
we expect to be running fallback mode to achieve a*similar*level of
performance to our current install?



I think is is not question about desktop environment (Unity 3D vs.
LXDE/XFCE) but question about thin vs. fat client. You should go for fat
client, if your desktop hardaware can do that. Fat client gives to you the
best desktop performance whatever desktop you are using, even KDE can fly
in fat client.

Test Alkis' ltsp-pnp (coming to 12.10), if your network environment and
needs are simple enough. It is awesome. I use it with Lubuntu. My PCs are
very basic ones: P4/NVidia Vanta/512M(emory).

If you can't go for fat client, then you have to test amd tweak and ask
what users are thinking.

So, I recommend something like Lubuntu/Xubuntu+ltsp-pnp/fat client. It
gives best performane with media support (audio, video, voip etc).

https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ltsp-pnp
http://wiki.lxde.org/en/Comparision_between_LXDE_and_Xfce
http://jonathancarter.org/2010/11/24/how-do-ltsp-fat-clients-work/

Best Regards Asmo Koskinen.








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Old 09-07-2012, 02:54 PM
Jack ODonnell
 
Default Desktop choice/performance

World Computer Exchange installs "edubuntu-desktop" on stand-alone
computers that we send to classrooms in developing countries. We do no
use LTSP.

In considering the upgrade to 12.04 from 10.04 as our standard OS, we
were concerned about how this would impact performance and the minimum
specs on our refurbished computers

We ran a comparison tests of performance with different desktops. I
don't pretend that the measures are scientifically accurate but they
showed general trend that helped us decide

We will be using 12.04 with the LXDE desktop

See attached
--
Jack ODonnell
Chicago Coordinator
Content Project Manager
Regional Manager for Latin America
773 316 2944

http://www.WorldComputerExchange.org Technology + Education = Potential
http://www.WorldComputerExchange.org/Chicago-il Chicago Chapter






On Fri, 2012-09-07 at 01:20 -0700, Matt Johnson wrote:
> We are running LTSP on Ubuntu 10.04 across 64 workstations distributed across 8 classrooms and in one computer suite in a school in Hertfordshire, UK.
>
> We are beginning to plan for our move to a fresh install of Edubuntu 12.04. I note that the Edubuntu screenshots page shows Unity, which we are keen to deploy, and then the more traditional desktop 'fallback' which is says is more suited to LTSP environments. This implies a performance hit for running Unity (2d?) in LTSP environments.
>
> What are folks' experiences of running Unity (2d?) versus the fallback mode in an LTSP deployment? Have people experienced a performance hit from moving from Gnome 2 on 10.04 to Unity 2d on 12.04? Realistically, should we expect to be running fallback mode to achieve a similar level of performance to our current install?
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
> --
> Matt
>
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Old 09-07-2012, 03:33 PM
"Rippl, Steve"
 
Default Desktop choice/performance

We experimented with the Lubuntu/LXDE desktop under 12.04 LTSP and it was great in terms if it's small resource requirements, however the Xubuntu/XFCE proved more useful to use because of it's greater configurability, we lock down the desktop to a considerable degree for the students and XFCE lets us do that while still having reasonable low hardware requirements.




On Fri, Sep 7, 2012 at 1:20 AM, Matt Johnson <johnsonmlw@yahoo.com> wrote:

We are running LTSP on Ubuntu 10.04 across 64 workstations distributed across 8 classrooms and in one computer suite in a school in Hertfordshire, UK.




We are beginning to plan for our move to a fresh install of Edubuntu 12.04. I note that the Edubuntu screenshots page shows Unity, which we are keen to deploy, and then the more traditional desktop 'fallback' which is says is more suited to LTSP environments. This implies a performance hit for running Unity (2d?) in LTSP environments.




What are folks' experiences of running Unity (2d?) versus the fallback mode in an LTSP deployment? Have people experienced a performance hit from moving from Gnome 2 on 10.04 to Unity 2d on 12.04?*Realistically, should we expect to be running fallback mode to achieve a*similar*level of performance to our current install?




Thanks in advance.



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