On Thursday 29 May 2008 21:28, Miles Fidelman wrote:
> Ron Johnson wrote:

> > Since 90% of all computers are DOS/Windows, and got that method from
> > CP/M, which did it that way back in 1976/77, your "gratuitously
> > different" comment is absurdly wrong.
>
> Actually, it dates back further than that, to ASR33 teletype machines,
> where you needed to issue separate carriage return and line feed
> characters to end a line - to i) physically return the carriage to the
> beginning of the line, and ii) feed a line of paper (turn the platten).
> (Anybody else out there old enough to remember when ASR33s where THE
> standard i/o device? :-)

I don't recall it being THE standard, but I recall that numerous
research Unix servers used to have DECwriter consoles as late as
the mid-1980s.

These had one small advantage over modern consoles, namely, they
were pretty loud. Sysadmins could use this to simulate psychic
powers -- when the server wrote an error message to its console,
you could hear it, subtly but distinctly, from several rooms
away. You could then announce to your less-attentive colleagues,
"there's a server problem," and they'd never figure out how
you knew.

Not that I ever did that. Purely hypothetical, you understand.

-- A.
--
Andrew Reid / reidac@bellatlantic.net


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Andrew Reid wrote:

On Thursday 29 May 2008 21:28, Miles Fidelman wrote:


Actually, it dates back further than that, to ASR33 teletype machines,
where you needed to issue separate carriage return and line feed
characters to end a line - to i) physically return the carriage to the
beginning of the line, and ii) feed a line of paper (turn the platten).
(Anybody else out there old enough to remember when ASR33s where THE
standard i/o device? :-)


I don't recall it being THE standard, but I recall that numerous

research Unix servers used to have DECwriter consoles as late as
the mid-1980s.


That's true, there were always Flexowriters, and all the IBM stuff :-)

These had one small advantage over modern consoles, namely, they
were pretty loud. Sysadmins could use this to simulate psychic
powers -- when the server wrote an error message to its console,
you could hear it, subtly but distinctly, from several rooms
away. You could then announce to your less-attentive colleagues,
"there's a server problem," and they'd never figure out how
you knew.

Not that I ever did that. Purely hypothetical, you understand.


But of course :-)

I still recall learning to touch type on an ASR33 (connected to an old
DG Nova as I recall, circa 1970 or so) - there was a 1/2 second delay
between striking a key, and the character being written, and it was just
about as hard to hit a key as on a manual typewriter. The first time I
used a real electric typewriter (IBM Selectric), boy did that mess up my
timing.



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> Andrew Reid wrote:
>> On Thursday 29 May 2008 21:28, Miles Fidelman wrote:
>>
>>> Actually, it dates back further than that, to ASR33 teletype machines,
>>> where you needed to issue separate carriage return and line feed
>>> characters to end a line - to i) physically return the carriage to the
>>> beginning of the line, and ii) feed a line of paper (turn the platten).
>>> (Anybody else out there old enough to remember when ASR33s where THE
>>> standard i/o device? :-)
>>>
>>
>> I don't recall it being THE standard, but I recall that numerous
>> research Unix servers used to have DECwriter consoles as late as
>> the mid-1980s.
>>
> That's true, there were always Flexowriters, and all the IBM stuff :-)
>> These had one small advantage over modern consoles, namely, they
>> were pretty loud. Sysadmins could use this to simulate psychic
>> powers -- when the server wrote an error message to its console,
>> you could hear it, subtly but distinctly, from several rooms
>> away. You could then announce to your less-attentive colleagues,
>> "there's a server problem," and they'd never figure out how
>> you knew.
>>
>> Not that I ever did that. Purely hypothetical, you understand.
>>
> But of course :-)
>
> I still recall learning to touch type on an ASR33 (connected to an old
> DG Nova as I recall, circa 1970 or so) - there was a 1/2 second delay
> between striking a key, and the character being written, and it was just
> about as hard to hit a key as on a manual typewriter. The first time I
> used a real electric typewriter (IBM Selectric), boy did that mess up my
> timing.

As I recall the reason for the delay was that the system used a form of
error detection called "echoplex"-the character was sent to the computer
and echoed at the computer back to the TTY at which point it was printed.
The human was the "detect and correct" mechanism. Obviously this
mechanism was outdated the minute the TTY was moved any distance from the
computer.
Larry
>
>
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