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Old 09-17-2012, 05:18 AM
Christian PERRIER
 
Default Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer

Quoting lee (lee@yun.yagibdah.de):
> Package: installation-reports
> Severity: wishlist
>
> Dear Maintainer,
>
> this is a feature request: It would be nice if users would have at
> least a web browser like lynx and an irc client available while they
> are using the installer. There has been/currently is a lengthy
> discussion about this on the debian-user mailing list starting with


Frankly speaking, I would very much prefer seeing people working on
current issues of the installer (I mean, not only during 3 months
before the release) rather than adding more bells, whistles and shiny
new features. It would be great if existing features were kept working
during the entire release process.

This is of course not targeted at you who reported this bug (don't
shoot the messenger)but more at all these people who have great ideas
on debian-user but never show up in development teams.

If you want a web browser, an IRC client, games, etc. in D-I, then
please come and first fix issues related to GRUB and encrypted
partitions, partitions sizes, preseeding, documentation, etc. *Then*
we'll see if we add a web browser.
 
Old 09-17-2012, 11:26 AM
Richard Owlett
 
Default Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer

Christian PERRIER wrote:

Quoting lee (lee@yun.yagibdah.de):

Package: installation-reports
Severity: wishlist

Dear Maintainer,

this is a feature request: It would be nice if users would have at
least a web browser like lynx and an irc client available while they
are using the installer. There has been/currently is a lengthy
discussion about this on the debian-user mailing list starting with



Frankly speaking, I would very much prefer seeing people working on
current issues of the installer (I mean, not only during 3 months
before the release) rather than adding more bells, whistles and shiny
new features. It would be great if existing features were kept working
during the entire release process.

This is of course not targeted at you who reported this bug (don't
shoot the messenger)but more at all these people who have great ideas
on debian-user but never show up in development teams.

If you want a web browser, an IRC client, games, etc. in D-I, then
please come and first fix issues related to GRUB and encrypted
partitions, partitions sizes, preseeding, documentation, etc. *Then*
we'll see if we add a web browser.




As I tried to say elsewhere in this thread, I suspect the
solution already exists in the liveCD. [and as an aside to
Mr. Thibault the reason I believe so is having used the CD
and followed several discussions on several Debian groups]


There are icons in lower right for several workspaces.
I've seen comments about switching consoles with function
key combinations.


Should one not be able to switch out of the installation
process and into a browser (2 are already included) to
search out answers? Although launching a browser internally
and loading a specific link may be a significant effort, if
my idea is technically feasible it would apparently only
require a page of instructional text.






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Old 09-17-2012, 12:27 PM
Jon Dowland
 
Default Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer

The installer (in expert mode) supports an ssh client on an alternative
VT, afaik. One can connect to another machine with stuff already
installed via this if necessary. Surely this is sufficient to address
the request.


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Old 09-17-2012, 05:58 PM
lee
 
Default Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer

Jon Dowland <jmtd@debian.org> writes:

> The installer (in expert mode) supports an ssh client on an alternative
> VT, afaik. One can connect to another machine with stuff already
> installed via this if necessary. Surely this is sufficient to address
> the request.

It requires you to have a computer you can connect to, and it is exactly
the need to have another working computer before installing Debian on
one which I would like to see eliminated. Or can I connect to yours any
time I might need to? Can I put software on some storage media like a
CD or DVD with that without having to come around to pick it up?

In case I do have another working computer, I don't need ssh to connect
to it. It's easier for me to use it directly.


--
Debian testing amd64


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Old 09-17-2012, 06:16 PM
lee
 
Default Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer

Christian PERRIER <bubulle@debian.org> writes:

> Quoting lee (lee@yun.yagibdah.de):
>> Package: installation-reports
>> Severity: wishlist
>>
>> Dear Maintainer,
>>
>> this is a feature request: It would be nice if users would have at
>> least a web browser like lynx and an irc client available while they
>> are using the installer. There has been/currently is a lengthy
>> discussion about this on the debian-user mailing list starting with
>
>
> Frankly speaking, I would very much prefer seeing people working on
> current issues of the installer (I mean, not only during 3 months
> before the release) rather than adding more bells, whistles and shiny
> new features. It would be great if existing features were kept working
> during the entire release process.

They'll do that or not, and we probably cannot decide for them what to
spend their time with.

> This is of course not targeted at you who reported this bug (don't
> shoot the messenger)but more at all these people who have great ideas
> on debian-user but never show up in development teams.

Did you show up on a development team to work on the issues you would
like to see the developers working on?

How do you show up on such a team? Did you ever try to provide a Debian
package? I'd have liked to and only found it being ridiculously
difficult, so I gave up on it. If you want to try, I probably still
have the sources and you can have them --- they'd need fixing though,
which I didn't because I don't need it anymore. I had it uploaded to
freshmeat or sourceforge, and last time I checked, they seemed to have
removed it. Well, not my loss ...

> If you want a web browser, an IRC client, games, etc. in D-I, then
> please come and first fix issues related to GRUB and encrypted
> partitions, partitions sizes, preseeding, documentation, etc. *Then*
> we'll see if we add a web browser.

Would it really require an excrutiating amount of effort to just add
lynx to what's available? It could probably be done with much less
effort than fixing the issues you mention and be helpful for users to
deal with these issues until they are fixed (at which time there'll be
new issues to deal with ...).

Anyway, the problem appears to be solved already


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Old 09-17-2012, 09:24 PM
Tom H
 
Default Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer

On Mon, Sep 17, 2012 at 2:16 PM, lee <lee@yun.yagibdah.de> wrote:
> Christian PERRIER <bubulle@debian.org> writes:
>>
>> Frankly speaking, I would very much prefer seeing people working on
>> current issues of the installer (I mean, not only during 3 months
>> before the release) rather than adding more bells, whistles and shiny
>> new features. It would be great if existing features were kept working
>> during the entire release process.
>
> They'll do that or not, and we probably cannot decide for them what to
> spend their time with.
>
>> This is of course not targeted at you who reported this bug (don't
>> shoot the messenger) but more at all these people who have great
>> ideas on debian-user but never show up in development teams.
>
> Did you show up on a development team to work on the issues you would
> like to see the developers working on?
>
> How do you show up on such a team? Did you ever try to provide a Debian
> package? I'd have liked to and only found it being ridiculously
> difficult, so I gave up on it. If you want to try, I probably still
> have the sources and you can have them --- they'd need fixing though,
> which I didn't because I don't need it anymore. I had it uploaded to
> freshmeat or sourceforge, and last time I checked, they seemed to have
> removed it. Well, not my loss ...

You seem to have misunderstood that Christian's one of d-i's
maintainers (he also seems to be a big fan of fonts!):

http://qa.debian.org/developer.php?login=bubulle&comaint=yes


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Old 09-17-2012, 10:21 PM
lee
 
Default Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer

Tom H <tomh0665@gmail.com> writes:

> You seem to have misunderstood that Christian's one of d-i's
> maintainers (he also seems to be a big fan of fonts!):

Well, I didn't know any of this, and he didn't mention it. I could help
with translations if they need some, no idea how to do that, though.


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Old 09-19-2012, 01:00 AM
lee
 
Default Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer

Jon Dowland <jmtd@debian.org> writes:

> The installer (in expert mode) supports an ssh client on an alternative
> VT, afaik. One can connect to another machine with stuff already
> installed via this if necessary. Surely this is sufficient to address
> the request.

This requires you to have the other machine you can connect to. The
idea is to be able to install without having another computer to fall
back to. The life-installer CD probably solves the problem; I'll have
to try it.


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Old 09-19-2012, 01:14 AM
lee
 
Default Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer

Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> writes:

> Should one not be able to switch out of the installation process and
> into a browser (2 are already included) to search out answers?

One should be able to. Since I haven't tried the life-installer yet, I
don't know what's possible. It would be nice if one could switch
between the installer and a browser any time after starting the
installation. I wouldn't say it's needed since one can just reboot from
the installer into the life system, assuming that one doesn't lose much
when doing so. This assumption might be a bad idea, though.


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Old 09-19-2012, 09:15 AM
Brian
 
Default Bug#687804: installation-reports: users are not able to review external documentation while stuck in the installer

On Wed 19 Sep 2012 at 03:14:05 +0200, lee wrote:

> Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> writes:
>
> > Should one not be able to switch out of the installation process and
> > into a browser (2 are already included) to search out answers?
>
> One should be able to. Since I haven't tried the life-installer yet, I
> don't know what's possible. It would be nice if one could switch
> between the installer and a browser any time after starting the
> installation. I wouldn't say it's needed since one can just reboot from
> the installer into the life system, assuming that one doesn't lose much
> when doing so. This assumption might be a bad idea, though.

Boot into a live sytem. Start a browser. Start d-i. ALT-TAB between the
two. Or CTRL-ALT-Fx for a virtual terminal.

The feature you requested exists. Surely the bug could now be closed?


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