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Old 04-15-2008, 01:31 AM
"David Fox"
 
Default Fwd: Packages temporarily disappearing from Testing/Lenny

Oops, I meant that to go to the list, sorry David.

On Sun, Apr 13, 2008 at 11:35 PM, David <wizzardx@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi list.
>
> Something I've noticed with Testing/Lenny is that packages often
> disappear for a short period (a few days or weeks) and then reappear.
> A few current examples: xmms and nvidia-glx. If you look on

I find that odd as well, since I am running Lenny (was running etch
whilst it was still the testing branch) and I have xmms available. If
the packages were going to be removed, wouldn't an aptitude
dist-upgrade flag it and/or attempt the removal? It has done so for
other packages, libraries for instance that are never used anymore.

For instance:

xmms:
Installed: 1:1.2.10+20070601-1+b1
Candidate: 1:1.2.10+20070601-1+b1
Version table:
*** 1:1.2.10+20070601-1+b1 0
100 /var/lib/dpkg/status

Seems to tell me that it is there, but there is no update or package
available, If I read that correctly.

The list of reverse depends follows:

xmms
Reverse Depends:
xmms-mp3cue
xmms-mac
bemused-xmms
peercast-handlers
imms
education-music
education-desktop-other
peercast-handlers
kvirc2
hotkeys
gdesklets-data
|fvwm-crystal
extace
education-music
education-desktop-other

I suppose I can remove xmms; I don't use it much. I tried removing it
before, but that was during the etch testing cycle, IIRC. And it
couldn't be removed as far as I remember because of dependency issues.

For what it is worth, a good replacement for xmms is
'beep-media-player' although others will have their preferences. I do
have that installed.


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Old 04-15-2008, 01:54 AM
Ron Johnson
 
Default Fwd: Packages temporarily disappearing from Testing/Lenny

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Hash: SHA1

On 04/14/08 20:31, David Fox wrote:
> Oops, I meant that to go to the list, sorry David.
>
> On Sun, Apr 13, 2008 at 11:35 PM, David <wizzardx@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Hi list.
> >
> > Something I've noticed with Testing/Lenny is that packages often
> > disappear for a short period (a few days or weeks) and then reappear.
> > A few current examples: xmms and nvidia-glx. If you look on
>
> I find that odd as well, since I am running Lenny (was running etch
> whilst it was still the testing branch) and I have xmms available. If
> the packages were going to be removed, wouldn't an aptitude
> dist-upgrade flag it and/or attempt the removal? It has done so for
> other packages, libraries for instance that are never used anymore.

That's the difference between libraries and apps. An app will be
removed if the dependent libraries are removed (by user or Debian),
and libraries will be flagged for removal if the *user* removes the
only app that uses them.

But if an app is removed from a repository, apt won't tell you.
deborphan might, though.

> For instance:
>
> xmms:
> Installed: 1:1.2.10+20070601-1+b1
> Candidate: 1:1.2.10+20070601-1+b1
> Version table:
> *** 1:1.2.10+20070601-1+b1 0
> 100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
>
> Seems to tell me that it is there, but there is no update or package
> available, If I read that correctly.

Yup.

[snip]
>
> I suppose I can remove xmms; I don't use it much. I tried removing it
> before, but that was during the etch testing cycle, IIRC. And it
> couldn't be removed as far as I remember because of dependency issues.
>
> For what it is worth, a good replacement for xmms is
> 'beep-media-player' although others will have their preferences. I do
> have that installed.
>
>


- --
Ron Johnson, Jr.
Jefferson LA USA

We want... a Shrubbery!!
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Old 04-15-2008, 02:01 AM
"David Fox"
 
Default Fwd: Packages temporarily disappearing from Testing/Lenny

On Mon, Apr 14, 2008 at 6:54 PM, Ron Johnson <ron.l.johnson@cox.net> wrote:
> But if an app is removed from a repository, apt won't tell you.
> deborphan might, though.

Understood so far.

But this isn't very helpful:

dfox@m206-157:/tmp$ deborphan xmms
xmms

And aptitude why-not xmms doesn't say anything other than "the package
xmms was manually installed". But it's got dependencies, and perhaps
one of those pulled it in. I can't remember if I explicitly asked for
it. Perhaps I did.


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Old 04-15-2008, 04:17 AM
NN_il_Confusionario
 
Default Fwd: Packages temporarily disappearing from Testing/Lenny

On Mon, Apr 14, 2008 at 07:01:55PM -0700, David Fox wrote:
> On Mon, Apr 14, 2008 at 6:54 PM, Ron Johnson <ron.l.johnson@cox.net> wrote:
> > But if an app is removed from a repository, apt won't tell you.
> > deborphan might, though.
> dfox@m206-157:/tmp$ deborphan xmms
> xmms
> And aptitude why-not xmms doesn't say anything other than "the package
> xmms was manually installed".

when a installed package is no more in any repository from sources.list
(not even in a different version from the installed one), then dselect
puts it into the "obsolete or locally installed" packages. The ncurses
interface of aptitude should do something of the same kind.

--
Chi usa software non libero avvelena anche te. Digli di smettere.
Informatica=arsenico: minime dosi in rari casi patologici, altrimenti letale.
Informatica=bomba: intelligente solo per gli stupidi che ci credono.


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Old 04-15-2008, 05:40 AM
Daniel Burrows
 
Default Fwd: Packages temporarily disappearing from Testing/Lenny

On Mon, Apr 14, 2008 at 08:54:10PM -0500, Ron Johnson <ron.l.johnson@cox.net> was heard to say:
> That's the difference between libraries and apps. An app will be
> removed if the dependent libraries are removed (by user or Debian),
> and libraries will be flagged for removal if the *user* removes the
> only app that uses them.
>
> But if an app is removed from a repository, apt won't tell you.

aptitude will put packages that have been removed from testing into a
separate category labeled "Obsolete and locally installed packages". In
unstable the command-line update also mentions if there are newly
obsolete packages after an update. You can get a list of obsolete
packages at the command-line by running

aptitude search "~o" (testing, unstable)
aptitude search "?obsolete" (unstable)

HTH,
Daniel


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Old 04-15-2008, 05:42 AM
Daniel Burrows
 
Default Fwd: Packages temporarily disappearing from Testing/Lenny

On Mon, Apr 14, 2008 at 07:01:55PM -0700, David Fox <dfox94085@gmail.com> was heard to say:
> On Mon, Apr 14, 2008 at 6:54 PM, Ron Johnson <ron.l.johnson@cox.net> wrote:
> > But if an app is removed from a repository, apt won't tell you.
> > deborphan might, though.
>
> Understood so far.
>
> But this isn't very helpful:
>
> dfox@m206-157:/tmp$ deborphan xmms
> xmms
>
> And aptitude why-not xmms doesn't say anything other than "the package
> xmms was manually installed". But it's got dependencies, and perhaps
> one of those pulled it in. I can't remember if I explicitly asked for
> it. Perhaps I did.

aptitude why-not <foo> only tells you who conflicts with <foo>. I
guess you mean "why"?

When it says xmms was manually installed, it means that it doesn't
think xmms is an automatic package. You could ask it who else requires
xmms with something like

aptitude why '~i!~M~n^xmms$' xmms

.

Daniel


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