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Old 08-21-2012, 11:08 PM
"Weaver"
 
Default New Mainboard.

>
>
>
>
>
>>________________________________
>> From: Weaver <weaver@riseup.net>
>>To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
>>Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2012 4:56 AM
>>Subject: New Mainboard.
>>
>>
>>Greetings all.
>>
>>I have decided on buying one of these:
>>
>>http://shop.amd.com/us/All/Detail/Processor/HDZ555WFGMBOX?SearchFacets=category%3AProcessor
>>
>>and, as I am going to put it into one of these:
>>
>>http://www.mittoni.com.au/lian-li-black-pca04-mini-tower-htpc-chassis-usb3-p-3948.html
>>
>>I need recommendations on Micro-ATX boards that will work in with that
>>context.
>
> Go here: *http://www.motherboards.org/mobot/* *Select your requirements
> and see what comes up. *The database isn't complete, really, and requires
> multiple trials to get useful (or any) output, but it does get you "in the
> ballpark."
>
>>It's a set-up that is going to last me a substantial number of years and
>> I
>>really don't need half a dozen sata or PCI sockets.
>>
>>One Primary IDE or Sata channel would be all I need.
>>I've got server space on the network.
>
> Whether IDE or SATA, you'll get at least two. *I myself prefer, for future
> expansion purposes, to have a 4 internal physical device option minimum.

I'm finding quite a number of M-ATX boards with just the one primary IDE
channel.
If I don't have an in-box ROM drive - I find an external one more useful
that I can move from box to box - That gives me two hard drives in-box.
As I said, I have plenty of server space. Moving files to the server when
I get short of drive space is no problem. *
>
>>I do deal with large graphics files and have as many as 11 virtual
>> windows
>>open with as many as half a dozen apps open in each, when I'm working, so
>>I'm looking at least 8 GB of RAM, but that's about it.
>
> It is rare that you'll find a micro-ATX board with more than 2 RAM slots
> due limited physical space. *If possible, for future expansion, since you
> plan to use this box a long time, I would try to find a MB that accepts up
> to 16GB RAM. *32 would be better. Every new release or OS upgrade requires
> more and more RAM as do the apps. *On this box which is 6 years old, I've
> gone from 2GB to 4 to 8 in that time. *From your use requirements, I
> consider 8GB a useful minimum. *I'm a commercial photographer (mostly),
> shoot mostly RAW images, which can be upwards of 20 to 30MB each and batch
> process hundreds of images at a time and only hit the swap very lightly.
> *I plan, in the near future, to increase to 16, the max the board will
> take.

Again, many of the M-ATX boards I'm looking at provide four slots and a
potential for 16 GB, with the ability to use 1800 Mh modules, so the
upgrade is no problem there.
I do more design and graphic work than photography, so that gives me some
leeway.*
>
>>What recommendations and what's the latest on this UEFI rubbish?
>
>
> Read this (and other articles about it), particular the Criticism at the
> bottom, and make your own decision:
>
> * *http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extensible_Firmware_Interface
>
> I currently avoid it, if I can.

I'd prefer to just on principle.
Any Microsoft innovation I want as far from my machines as possible.
Part of my 'Untrusted Computing Programme'.

Thanks,

Weaver.
>
> B *
>
>
> --
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>


--
"I invite you to name a society that created a secret prison
system, outside the rule of law, where torture takes place,
that sooner or later didn't turn the abuse against it's own
citizens. -- Naomi Wolf - October 11, 2007


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Old 08-22-2012, 03:03 PM
Camaleón
 
Default New Mainboard.

On Tue, 21 Aug 2012 15:55:01 -0700, Weaver wrote:

>> On Tue, 21 Aug 2012 04:56:58 -0700, Weaver wrote:
(...)
>>> I need recommendations on Micro-ATX boards that will work in with that
>>> context.
>>
>> (...)
>>
>> I'd look for either MSI or Gigabyte boards as both brands do high
>> quality products. And I would also choose a solution with integrated
>> VGA (ATI) to keep the case as clean and organized as possible with the
>> less cables and cooling fans as I can (less coolers, less dust :-P).
>> Also, I would look for a BIOS (non UEFI) product.
>
> Yes.
> This last I have been trying to do, but the large manufacturers seem to
> be somewhat shy about listing what BIOS is available on each board these
> days.

Agree, manufacturers are hidding these "advanced specs" (sigh...) to the
users so when you find a board of you liking, just directly ask them
about this.

> I usually go for ASUS, but their site is a nightmare to navigate,
> compared to how it used to be.

Asus used to be in my list but since my good P2B-S and CUV4X (both for
Pentium III) I've only read but problems and issues with their new boards
and Linux. You know, all that fancy "turbo-mega-hyper-silent-green-dual-
bios-fast-recovery" stuff that can indeed work fine when you load the
Windows drivers ;-P

Greetings,

--
Camaleón


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Old 08-22-2012, 08:34 PM
"Weaver"
 
Default New Mainboard.

> On Tue, 21 Aug 2012 15:55:01 -0700, Weaver wrote:
>
>>> On Tue, 21 Aug 2012 04:56:58 -0700, Weaver wrote:
> (...)
>>>> I need recommendations on Micro-ATX boards that will work in with that
>>>> context.
>>>
>>> (...)
>>>
>>> I'd look for either MSI or Gigabyte boards as both brands do high
>>> quality products. And I would also choose a solution with integrated
>>> VGA (ATI) to keep the case as clean and organized as possible with the
>>> less cables and cooling fans as I can (less coolers, less dust :-P).
>>> Also, I would look for a BIOS (non UEFI) product.
>>
>> Yes.
>> This last I have been trying to do, but the large manufacturers seem to
>> be somewhat shy about listing what BIOS is available on each board these
>> days.
>
> Agree, manufacturers are hidding these "advanced specs" (sigh...) to the
> users so when you find a board of you liking, just directly ask them
> about this.
>
>> I usually go for ASUS, but their site is a nightmare to navigate,
>> compared to how it used to be.
>
> Asus used to be in my list but since my good P2B-S and CUV4X (both for
> Pentium III) I've only read but problems and issues with their new boards
> and Linux. You know, all that fancy "turbo-mega-hyper-silent-green-dual-
> bios-fast-recovery" stuff that can indeed work fine when you load the
> Windows drivers ;-P

Yes.
Funny you should mention it, but I've just been given a CU4VX with a P3
mounted in good order.
I'm going to load it up with all my old, spare IDE drives and turn it into
a small file server.
It's ATA133 capable.
Regards,

Weaver.

--
"I invite you to name a society that created a secret prison
system, outside the rule of law, where torture takes place,
that sooner or later didn't turn the abuse against it's own
citizens. -- Naomi Wolf - October 11, 2007


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Old 08-22-2012, 11:55 PM
Patrick Bartek
 
Default New Mainboard.

----- Original Message -----
> From: Weaver <weaver@riseup.net>
> To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
> Cc: "debian-user@lists.debian.org" <debian-user@lists.debian.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2012 4:08 PM
> Subject: Re: New Mainboard.
>
>> Whether IDE or SATA, you'll get at least two. *I myself prefer, for
> future
>> expansion purposes, to have a 4 internal physical device option minimum.
>
> I'm finding quite a number of M-ATX boards with just the one primary IDE
> channel.

Now that you mention it, I came across a number of micro boards like that when I was researching building a digital video recorder. *Don't really need more than two devices--hard drive and DVD or Blu-ray burner. *And the boxes the MB are designed to fit it won't hold anymore anyway.

>>
>> It is rare that you'll find a micro-ATX board with more than 2 RAM
>> slots [snip]
>
> Again, many of the M-ATX boards I'm looking at provide four slots and a
> potential for 16 GB, with the ability to use 1800 Mh modules, so the
> upgrade is no problem there.
> I do more design and graphic work than photography, so that gives me some
> leeway.*
>>


These days more RAM is more useful than more devices. *If you can find a suitable board that has 4 RAM slots, that's the way to go. *If you can find one with a 32GB maximum that would be, in my opinion, preferred.

Also, because of your type of work like mine, onboard graphics will probably not be enough. *So, allow for a fast graphics card.

B


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Old 08-23-2012, 02:13 AM
"Weaver"
 
Default New Mainboard.

>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Weaver <weaver@riseup.net>
>> To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
>> Cc: "debian-user@lists.debian.org" <debian-user@lists.debian.org>
>> Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2012 4:08 PM
>> Subject: Re: New Mainboard.
>>
>>> Whether IDE or SATA, you'll get at least two. *I myself prefer, for
>> future
>>> expansion purposes, to have a 4 internal physical device option
>>> minimum.
>>
>> I'm finding quite a number of M-ATX boards with just the one primary IDE
>> channel.
>
> Now that you mention it, I came across a number of micro boards like that
> when I was researching building a digital video recorder. *Don't really
> need more than two devices--hard drive and DVD or Blu-ray burner. *And the
> boxes the MB are designed to fit it won't hold anymore anyway.

I'm finding what they will fit into that space, amazing.
You could have the two internal HDDs if you used an external ROM.

* Model: PC-A04.
* Case Type: Mini Tower Chassis.
* Dimensions: (W) 188mm x (H) 386mm x (D) 460mm.
* Front bezel Material: Aluminium.
* Colour: Black.
* Side Panel: Aluminium.
* Body Material: Aluminium.
* Net Weight: 4.1KG.
* 5.25" drive bay (External): 2.
* 3.5" drive bay (External): None.
* 3.5" drive bay (Internal): 7.
* Expansion Slot: 4.
* Motherboard: Micro-ATX / Mini-ITX.
* System Fan (Front): 120mm Fan x 2.
* System Fan (Top): 120mm Fan x 1.
* System Fan (Rear): None.
* I/O Ports: USB3.0 x 1 / USB2.0 x 1 / e-SATA x 1 / HD Audio.
* 2.5" drive bay (Internal): 1.
* Maximum Video Card Length: 370mm.

You sacrifice a bit of that drive space if you need that sized Video Card,
because you have to remove the upper drive cage to fit it in, but there's
still more than two drive spaces.
>
>>>
>>> It is rare that you'll find a micro-ATX board with more than 2 RAM
>>> slots [snip]
>>
>> Again, many of the M-ATX boards I'm looking at provide four slots and a
>> potential for 16 GB, with the ability to use 1800 Mh modules, so the
>> upgrade is no problem there.
>> I do more design and graphic work than photography, so that gives me
>> some
>> leeway.*
>>>
>
>
> These days more RAM is more useful than more devices. *If you can find a
> suitable board that has 4 RAM slots, that's the way to go. *If you can
> find one with a 32GB maximum that would be, in my opinion, preferred.
>
> Also, because of your type of work like mine, onboard graphics will
> probably not be enough. *So, allow for a fast graphics card.

Restricted as to that, by finances, but definitely 'on the cards' a little
further down the track.
Cheers,

Weaver

--
"I invite you to name a society that created a secret prison
system, outside the rule of law, where torture takes place,
that sooner or later didn't turn the abuse against it's own
citizens. -- Naomi Wolf - October 11, 2007


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Old 08-23-2012, 05:32 AM
Arun Khan
 
Default New Mainboard.

On Wed, Aug 22, 2012 at 4:25 AM, Weaver <weaver@riseup.net> wrote:

> This last I have been trying to do, but the large manufacturers seem to be
> somewhat shy about listing what BIOS is available on each board these
> days.

Once I have short listed the boards I am interested in and are
available in the market, I download their respective manuals. They
usually have the BIOS details.

-- Arun Khan


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Old 08-23-2012, 05:55 AM
Andreas Weber
 
Default New Mainboard.

On 2012-08-22 17:03, Camaleón wrote:
> Asus used to be in my list but since my good P2B-S and CUV4X (both for
> Pentium III) I've only read but problems and issues with their new boards
> and Linux. You know, all that fancy "turbo-mega-hyper-silent-green-dual-
> bios-fast-recovery" stuff that can indeed work fine when you load the
> Windows drivers ;-P

I have not only read about, I also tested. This is my setup, and it
works perfectly:

- Asus board (with UEFI and BIOS mode)
- SSD with GPT
- installed Debian as usual with grub-pc
- no special EFI boot partition or whatever

Boots perfectly in BIOS mode.

I tried about 5 variants of installing Debian with UEFI on it, without
success. Ubuntu on the other hand installed in a few minutes with UEFI,
is part of the installer and a walk in the park. Debian is not there yet.

In the end I went for BIOS mode because I wanted Debian and the boot
time is great. There is no benefit in UEFI when it comes to boot times,
at least not for the regular single/multi boot user.

Just my 2c.

ändu


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Old 08-23-2012, 06:37 AM
"Weaver"
 
Default New Mainboard.

> On Wed, Aug 22, 2012 at 4:25 AM, Weaver <weaver@riseup.net> wrote:
>
>> This last I have been trying to do, but the large manufacturers seem to
>> be
>> somewhat shy about listing what BIOS is available on each board these
>> days.
>
> Once I have short listed the boards I am interested in and are
> available in the market, I download their respective manuals. They
> usually have the BIOS details.

I didn't even think of that.
I just thought it would be (or should be) an automatic annotation on their
product descrption, on-site.

In which case, the Gigabyte GA-MA785GPMT-UD2H; GA-MA785GMT-US2H both seem
to be fine.

Will get back to confirm once I have it up and running.
Regards and thanks,

Weaver.
--
"I invite you to name a society that created a secret prison
system, outside the rule of law, where torture takes place,
that sooner or later didn't turn the abuse against it's own
citizens. -- Naomi Wolf - October 11, 2007


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