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Old 06-23-2012, 06:33 PM
Joe
 
Default A qualified "Yes" - was

On Sat, 23 Jun 2012 12:30:55 -0500
Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> wrote:

> Richard Owlett wrote:
> > I did not use the term "alternate" as that already has a
> > specific meaning in this context.
> > I also used "contrarian" instead of "experimental" to
> > emphasize I'm looking for something aimed at a different
> > target audience.
> >
> > My experiments have demonstrated that the Debian installer
> > team has producer a very robust product which meets the
> > needs/desires of a very large percentage of its intended
> > audience.
> >
> > Having recently read the announcement of apt-offline version
> > 1.2, I think something I'd like would be possible.
> >
> > What I would like to have:
> > CLI, dial up on a full analog modem (USB connection), WiFi
> > connectivity, apt-offline.
> >
> > Options I would likely download almost immediately:
> > X11, a very simple GUI (NOT a 'desktop _environment_),
> > Tcl/Tk & gnuplot (I've existing projects).
> >
> > TIA
> >
>
> It appears that I can reach my goal using netinst.iso.
> I doubt that few, if any, would recommend my goals or route.
>
> From my reading, I suspect that I'm headed down a path
> similar to an old/abandoned project for a highly
> customizable small footprint Linux install. [Can't recall
> the project's name.]
>
> I any case I'll learn the guts of Linux. I'm retired so I've
> time and no _outside_ constraints.
>
> Thanks to all.
>

If you really do have plenty of time, you might want to look at Linux
From Scratch. I built a couple of systems in its early days, before I
settled on Debian, mainly to try to get some understanding of what is
really necessary in a Linux system. It's all very well to say 'just
remove the packages you don't need' but which are they?

Even if you don't fancy the fairly tedious slog of actually compiling a
Linux system completely from source (and I gave up at the command
line, I didn't go on to add X), the documentation ('The Book') contains
information that might be of interest to you. The current one is:

http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/lfs/downloads/stable/LFS-BOOK-7.1.pdf

There are various references on the Net to 'Debian From Scratch' but
they seem to refer to installing Debian using various methods rather
than actually compiling it from source. I think (c)debootstrap has
already been mentioned in this context.

--
Joe


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Old 06-23-2012, 06:33 PM
Richard Owlett
 
Default A qualified "Yes" - was

Neal Murphy wrote:

On Saturday 23 June 2012 13:30:55 Richard Owlett wrote:

It appears that I can reach my goal using netinst.iso.
I doubt that few, if any, would recommend my goals or route.


I'd certainly recommend your approach over building your own distro! Although
I might give Linux From Scratch a plug. If learning's your goal andit isn't
too low-level for you, you'll learn a lot about how GNU/Linux is built from
source packages.


*BINGO* - see below ;/





From my reading, I suspect that I'm headed down a path
similar to an old/abandoned project for a highly
customizable small footprint Linux install. [Can't recall
the project's name.]


Puppy Linux? Damn Small Linux?



Puppies, DSL, Tiny Core etc. was where I started after
deciding Ubuntu Wasn't for me.


Although I considered Puppies overweight with missing
required features and it was unclear if DSL could access a
suitable code library, they demonstrated that one could do a
lot in far less than 1 *FULL* CD.


"Linux From Scratch" is the project I was thinking of. I
discounted it at the time as I last did compile-link-load
~30 years ago. No thanks. There is probably much there that
will help me define my project goals.


You just saved me a lot of searching. Thank you.




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Old 06-23-2012, 08:14 PM
Richard Owlett
 
Default A qualified "Yes" - was

Joe wrote:

On Sat, 23 Jun 2012 12:30:55 -0500
Richard Owlett<rowlett@cloud85.net> wrote:


Richard Owlett wrote:

I did not use the term "alternate" as that already has a
specific meaning in this context.
I also used "contrarian" instead of "experimental" to
emphasize I'm looking for something aimed at a different
target audience.

My experiments have demonstrated that the Debian installer
team has producer a very robust product which meets the
needs/desires of a very large percentage of its intended
audience.

Having recently read the announcement of apt-offline version
1.2, I think something I'd like would be possible.

What I would like to have:
CLI, dial up on a full analog modem (USB connection), WiFi
connectivity, apt-offline.

Options I would likely download almost immediately:
X11, a very simple GUI (NOT a 'desktop _environment_),
Tcl/Tk& gnuplot (I've existing projects).

TIA



It appears that I can reach my goal using netinst.iso.
I doubt that few, if any, would recommend my goals or route.

From my reading, I suspect that I'm headed down a path
similar to an old/abandoned project for a highly
customizable small footprint Linux install. [Can't recall
the project's name.]

I any case I'll learn the guts of Linux. I'm retired so I've
time and no _outside_ constraints.

Thanks to all.



If you really do have plenty of time, you might want to look at Linux
From Scratch.


As you wrote I was telling Neal that was the project I was
trying to recall.




I built a couple of systems in its early days, before I
settled on Debian, mainly to try to get some understanding of what is
really necessary in a Linux system. It's all very well to say 'just
remove the packages you don't need' but which are they?

Even if you don't fancy the fairly tedious slog of actually compiling a
Linux system completely from source (and I gave up at the command
line, I didn't go on to add X), the documentation ('The Book') contains
information that might be of interest to you. The current one is:

http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/lfs/downloads/stable/LFS-BOOK-7.1.pdf

There are various references on the Net to 'Debian From Scratch' but
they seem to refer to installing Debian using various methods rather
than actually compiling it from source. I think (c)debootstrap has
already been mentioned in this context.



"debootstrap" had not been mentioned that I recall.
It will save me from reinventing wheel.

Useful pages may include:
http://wiki.debian.org/Debootstrap
http://www.debian-administration.org/articles/426
http://packages.debian.org/squeeze/debootstrap
http://wiki.debian.org/EmDebian/CrossDebootstrap
http://www.digriz.org.uk/debian/debootstrap



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Old 06-24-2012, 02:22 AM
Richard Owlett
 
Default A qualified "Yes" - was

Richard Owlett wrote:

Joe wrote:

[snip]

There are various references on the Net to 'Debian From
Scratch' but
they seem to refer to installing Debian using various
methods rather
than actually compiling it from source. I think
(c)debootstrap has
already been mentioned in this context.



"debootstrap" had not been mentioned that I recall.
It will save me from reinventing wheel.


Unfortunately it won't.
In my quick scan of the documentation I misread the first
sentence of http://wiki.debian.org/Debootstrap . It states:
"debootstrap is a tool which will install a Debian base
system into a subdirectory of another, *_already installed
system_* ." [EMPHASIS added]




[snip]




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Old 06-24-2012, 08:07 AM
Tom H
 
Default A qualified "Yes" - was

On Sat, Jun 23, 2012 at 10:22 PM, Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> wrote:
> Richard Owlett wrote:
>> Joe wrote:
>>>
>>> There are various references on the Net to 'Debian From
>>> Scratch' but
>>> they seem to refer to installing Debian using various
>>> methods rather
>>> than actually compiling it from source. I think
>>> (c)debootstrap has
>>> already been mentioned in this context.
>>
>> "debootstrap" had not been mentioned that I recall.
>> It will save me from reinventing wheel.
>
> Unfortunately it won't.
> In my quick scan of the documentation I misread the first sentence of
> http://wiki.debian.org/Debootstrap . It states:
> "debootstrap is a tool which will install a Debian base system into a
> subdirectory of another, *_already installed system_* ." [EMPHASIS added]

The "already installed system" can be a "Live" one.


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Old 06-24-2012, 08:27 AM
Andrei POPESCU
 
Default A qualified "Yes" - was

On Sb, 23 iun 12, 21:22:38, Richard Owlett wrote:
> >
> >"debootstrap" had not been mentioned that I recall.
> >It will save me from reinventing wheel.
>
> Unfortunately it won't.
> In my quick scan of the documentation I misread the first sentence
> of http://wiki.debian.org/Debootstrap . It states:
> "debootstrap is a tool which will install a Debian base system into
> a subdirectory of another, *_already installed system_* ." [EMPHASIS
> added]

Well, how else would you expect to run debootstrap if not from within
some running system?

Kind regards,
Andrei
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