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Old 05-05-2012, 10:10 PM
Richard Owlett
 
Default netinst.iso - a "learning experience"- Part 1 grub

Why a "learning experience"?
'Cause when I've finished recovering, I'll know more ;/

The install went fairly smoothly until it set up Grub. I had
opted for guided install using all free space. It correctly
detected Windows and asked permission to write to boot
partition. I accepted.


NOW, when system boots I have 2 choices - Debian and Debian
in recovery mode.

a. Why?
b. Can I do anything at this point to allow choice to boot
Windows?
[Not sure whether I have WinXP or Vista. Bought a used
Thinkpad R61 explicitly to experiment. No critical files
there but having a familiar OS would be very convenient.
Worst case, I advance experiments with Wine. I have only one
must have program which depends on a Windows environment and
it is known to run well under Wine.]


TIA


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Old 05-06-2012, 05:06 AM
Johan Grönqvist
 
Default netinst.iso - a "learning experience"- Part 1 grub

2012-05-06 00:10, Richard Owlett skrev:

Why a "learning experience"?
'Cause when I've finished recovering, I'll know more ;/

NOW, when system boots I have 2 choices - Debian and Debian in recovery
mode.



b. Can I do anything at this point to allow choice to boot Windows?


I think I have seen similar behaviour after installation, and that it
was fixed by running update-grub (as root) on the command line.


After an update-grub run, I again had a windows option.

/ johan




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Old 05-06-2012, 07:06 AM
Ralf Mardorf
 
Default netinst.iso - a "learning experience"- Part 1 grub

On Sun, 2012-05-06 at 08:30 +0200, an unknown sender wrote:
> b. Can I do anything at this point to allow choice to boot
> Windows?

The menu is in /boot/grub/grub.cfg (GRUB 2) or /boot/grub/menu.lst (GRUB
Legacy).
You don't need to know what Windows you have installed, since it's done
by chainloading. This is from my menu.lst:

#title Windows
#rootnoverify (hd0,0)
#makeactive
#chainloader +1

Of cause, you need to uncomment it, IOW remove the "#"s.

If you use GRUB 2, more likely for a default Debian install , than
perhaps running "update-grub" with root privileges might add Windows
automatically to grub.cfg. If not, I would recommend to switch to GRUB
Legacy, since for a beginner it's easier to handle. You directly will
edit menu.lst and it's including out-commented examples, such as the
Windows chainload.

- Ralf






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Old 05-06-2012, 09:55 AM
Camaleón
 
Default netinst.iso - a "learning experience"- Part 1 grub

On Sat, 05 May 2012 17:10:14 -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:

> Why a "learning experience"?
> 'Cause when I've finished recovering, I'll know more ;/

That did not sound reassuring :-(

> The install went fairly smoothly until it set up Grub.

You mean Squeeze or Wheezy netinstall?

> I had opted for guided install using all free space. It correctly
> detected Windows and asked permission to write to boot partition. I
> accepted.

After doing that, now the Windows bootloader has been replaced with
GRUB2. There's another option, though.

> NOW, when system boots I have 2 choices - Debian and Debian in recovery
> mode.
> a. Why?

Why, what...? Because you have installed Debian, right? :-?

> b. Can I do anything at this point to allow choice to boot Windows?

Ah, that.

Well, I don't know if that's supported right after the installation. If
yes, if it's supported and does not work, you can open a bug report
against the installer.

> [Not sure whether I have WinXP or Vista. Bought a used Thinkpad R61
> explicitly to experiment. No critical files there but having a familiar
> OS would be very convenient. Worst case, I advance experiments with
> Wine. I have only one must have program which depends on a Windows
> environment and it is known to run well under Wine.]

Windows is still there, don't panic, is just you:

- Have replaced its NTloader (Windows boot loader) with another boot
loader (GRUB2).

- The new bootloder (GRUB2) has to detect (or you have to manually add an
entry) the available OSes in your system, which is not always an easy
task. GRUB2 has a tool for doing that automatically (by means of the "os-
prober" script) which I think is run by the installer but as anything in
this world, it can fail :-)

Greetings,

--
Camaleón


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Old 05-06-2012, 11:41 AM
Richard Owlett
 
Default netinst.iso - a "learning experience"- Part 1 grub

Johan Grönqvist wrote:

2012-05-06 00:10, Richard Owlett skrev:

Why a "learning experience"?
'Cause when I've finished recovering, I'll know more ;/

NOW, when system boots I have 2 choices - Debian and
Debian in recovery
mode.



b. Can I do anything at this point to allow choice to boot
Windows?


I think I have seen similar behaviour after installation,
and that it was fixed by running update-grub (as root) on
the command line.

After an update-grub run, I again had a windows option.

/ johan




Thank you. I thought that was the answer. But I've learned
caution in the last 4 decades.


It worked. I now have access to Windows again (for what
that's worth




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Old 05-06-2012, 12:05 PM
Richard Owlett
 
Default netinst.iso - a "learning experience"- Part 1 grub

Ralf Mardorf wrote:

On Sun, 2012-05-06 at 08:30 +0200, an unknown sender wrote:

b. Can I do anything at this point to allow choice to boot
Windows?


The menu is in /boot/grub/grub.cfg (GRUB 2) or /boot/grub/menu.lst (GRUB
Legacy).
You don't need to know what Windows you have installed, since it's done
by chainloading. This is from my menu.lst:

#title Windows
#rootnoverify (hd0,0)
#makeactive
#chainloader +1

Of cause, you need to uncomment it, IOW remove the "#"s.

If you use GRUB 2, more likely for a default Debian install , than
perhaps running "update-grub" with root privileges might add Windows
automatically to grub.cfg. If not, I would recommend to switch to GRUB
Legacy, since for a beginner it's easier to handle. You directly will
edit menu.lst and it's including out-commented examples, such as the
Windows chainload.

- Ralf



Yes I have GRUB2, a default Debian install from netist.iso
downloaded yesterday.

update-grub successfully did its thing.

Using Grub Legacy is attractive.
How complex would the change be?
In the future would an "update" or "upgrade" try to move
me back to GRUB2?


I know that part of "advantage" of GRUB2 is handling newer
hardware/technology. I would have to check to see if that
would be helpful to me in near future.




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Old 05-06-2012, 12:26 PM
Richard Owlett
 
Default netinst.iso - a "learning experience"- Part 1 grub

Camaleón wrote:

On Sat, 05 May 2012 17:10:14 -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:


Why a "learning experience"?
'Cause when I've finished recovering, I'll know more ;/


That did not sound reassuring :-(


Why? Although the trigger for moving to Linux was annoyance
with Gates & Co., my methodology is *STRONGLY* motivated my
learning the guts of Linux. Being retired means I have time
in abundance.





The install went fairly smoothly until it set up Grub.


You mean Squeeze or Wheezy netinstall?


Version 6.0.4 Without double checking I believe that's
"Squeeze".


That caused me to notice that there was no intuitively
obvious way to determine what version is running. I had to
look at the file name of the iso file.






I had opted for guided install using all free space. It correctly
detected Windows and asked permission to write to boot partition. I
accepted.


After doing that, now the Windows bootloader has been replaced with
GRUB2. There's another option, though.


NOW, when system boots I have 2 choices - Debian and Debian in recovery
mode.
a. Why?


Why, what...? Because you have installed Debian, right? :-?


This was the latest of several installs. All the previous
installs had access to the Windows OS.






b. Can I do anything at this point to allow choice to boot Windows?


Ah, that.

Well, I don't know if that's supported right after the installation. If
yes, if it's supported and does not work, you can open a bug report
against the installer.


[Not sure whether I have WinXP or Vista. Bought a used Thinkpad R61
explicitly to experiment. No critical files there but having a familiar
OS would be very convenient. Worst case, I advance experiments with
Wine. I have only one must have program which depends on a Windows
environment and it is known to run well under Wine.]


Windows is still there, don't panic, is just you:

- Have replaced its NTloader (Windows boot loader) with another boot
loader (GRUB2).

- The new bootloder (GRUB2) has to detect (or you have to manually add an
entry) the available OSes in your system, which is not always an easy
task. GRUB2 has a tool for doing that automatically (by means of the "os-
prober" script) which I think is run by the installer but as anything in
this world, it can fail :-)

Greetings,



update-grub solved immediate problem.



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Old 05-06-2012, 01:25 PM
Camaleón
 
Default netinst.iso - a "learning experience"- Part 1 grub

On Sun, 06 May 2012 07:26:39 -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:

> Camaleón wrote:
>> On Sat, 05 May 2012 17:10:14 -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:
>>
>>> Why a "learning experience"?
>>> 'Cause when I've finished recovering, I'll know more ;/
>>
>> That did not sound reassuring :-(
>
> Why? Although the trigger for moving to Linux was annoyance with Gates &
> Co., my methodology is *STRONGLY* motivated my learning the guts of
> Linux. Being retired means I have time in abundance.

Why having to "recover" does not sound reassuring?

Well, recover means something have failed (or something went wrong) and
of course a failure is not something I would tag as a "pleasurable
experience" :-)

>> You mean Squeeze or Wheezy netinstall?
>
> Version 6.0.4 Without double checking I believe that's "Squeeze".
>
> That caused me to notice that there was no intuitively obvious way to
> determine what version is running. I had to look at the file name of the
> iso file.

You soon will get accustomed to match the numbers with the codename :-)

I remember quite well Lenny was 5.x and Squeeze 6.x because I started
using Debian since Lenny but if you ask me what's the codename for Debian
3.x I can't tell unless I read it.

>>> NOW, when system boots I have 2 choices - Debian and Debian in
>>> recovery mode.
>>> a. Why?
>>
>> Why, what...? Because you have installed Debian, right? :-?
>
> This was the latest of several installs. All the previous installs had
> access to the Windows OS.

The last time I dual-booted a system it was a mix between windows 98 and
SuSE 8.2 and I used GRUB Legacy. By that time (~8 years ago) I had to
manually add the Windows stanza at GRUB's menu so Windows could be booted
from there. I mean, old linux users are used to do things manually but
now that's starting to change (I still don't know if that's for good,
though...).

>> Windows is still there, don't panic, is just you:
>>
>> - Have replaced its NTloader (Windows boot loader) with another boot
>> loader (GRUB2).
>>
>> - The new bootloder (GRUB2) has to detect (or you have to manually add
>> an entry) the available OSes in your system, which is not always an
>> easy task. GRUB2 has a tool for doing that automatically (by means of
>> the "os- prober" script) which I think is run by the installer but as
>> anything in this world, it can fail :-)
>>
>>
> update-grub solved immediate problem.

Yes, because running the command should trigger the "os-prober" script
(unless it has been explicitly disabled) :-)

Greetings,

--
Camaleón


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Old 05-06-2012, 02:36 PM
Ralf Mardorf
 
Default netinst.iso - a "learning experience"- Part 1 grub

On Sun, 2012-05-06 at 15:40 +0200, an unknown sender wrote:
> Using Grub Legacy is attractive.
> How complex would the change be?

Remove GRUB 2 and install GRUB Legacy. That's it.

> In the future would an "update" or "upgrade" try to move
> me back to GRUB2?

I don't think so.

> I know that part of "advantage" of GRUB2 is handling newer
> hardware/technology. I would have to check to see if that
> would be helpful to me in near future.

I didn't know about that.

- Ralf


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Old 05-06-2012, 02:54 PM
Brian
 
Default netinst.iso - a "learning experience"- Part 1 grub

On Sun 06 May 2012 at 07:05:42 -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:

> Ralf Mardorf wrote:
>>
>> If you use GRUB 2, more likely for a default Debian install , than
>> perhaps running "update-grub" with root privileges might add Windows
>> automatically to grub.cfg. If not, I would recommend to switch to GRUB
>> Legacy, since for a beginner it's easier to handle. You directly will
>> edit menu.lst and it's including out-commented examples, such as the
>> Windows chainload.
>
> Yes I have GRUB2, a default Debian install from netist.iso downloaded
> yesterday.
> update-grub successfully did its thing.
>
> Using Grub Legacy is attractive.
> How complex would the change be?

Not too complex, I'd think - but why bother? Nobody cares about GRUB
legacy in any serious way. You can choose to be among the dwindling
number of people who still use it but it will continue to rot away
while GRUB 2 receives all the attention.


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