Problem Installing libc6 (eglibc) from netboot image
 

It seems that during a preseeded installation today my squeeze VM installed a proposed update when it shouldn't have:

> root@test:/usr/share/doc# dpkg -l |grep 2.11.3-3
> ii libc-bin 2.11.3-3 Embedded GNU C Library: Binaries
> ii libc6 2.11.3-3 Embedded GNU C Library: Shared libraries
> ii locales 2.11.3-3 Embedded GNU C Library: National Language (locale) data [support]
> ii nscd 2.11.3-3 Embedded GNU C Library: Name Service Cache Daemon


This breaks dependencies:

> root@test:/# apt-get install build-essential
> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
> build-essential : Depends: libc6-dev but it is not going to be installed or
> libc-dev
> Depends: g++ (>= 4:4.4.3) but it is not going to be installed
> E: Broken packages
>

following the chain down…

> root@test:/etc# apt-get install libc6-i386
> ...
> libc6-i386 : Depends: libc6 (= 2.11.3-2) but 2.11.3-3 is to be installed


Now this is odd because squeeze (stable) is only supposed to be installing 2.11.3-2:
http://packages.debian.org/source/squeeze/eglibc

2.11.3-3 is available in proposed updates:
http://qa.debian.org/madison.php?package=eglibc

And is downloadable:
http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/pool/main/e/eglibc/


And of course, my sources.list is a squeeze-only list and does not contain proposed updates. I think this is supported because "apt-cache showpkg libc6" shows the new version (already installed) and the old version in the repository. So I think the netboot installer somehow incorrectly installed the proposed-update. Or maybe a repository temporarily contained the new version when it shouldn't have. Or maybe the new version is being rolled out right now but all the mirrors haven't been updated yet.

Or maybe I'm messed something up. This doesn't effect me too terribly right now, I just wanted to post this in case someone else was having a similar problem.

-Chris

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Problem Installing libc6 (eglibc) from netboot image
 

Chris Hiestand wrote:
> It seems that during a preseeded installation today my squeeze VM
> installed a proposed update when it shouldn't have:

Or did you simply catch an archive in the middle of being updated?
That shouldn't happen but depends upon the mirror you are using.

> > root@test:/usr/share/doc# dpkg -l |grep 2.11.3-3
> > ii libc-bin 2.11.3-3 Embedded GNU C Library: Binaries
> > ii libc6 2.11.3-3 Embedded GNU C Library: Shared libraries
> > ii locales 2.11.3-3 Embedded GNU C Library: National Language (locale) data [support]
> > ii nscd 2.11.3-3 Embedded GNU C Library: Name Service Cache Daemon

Those appeared in Squeeze today.

> This breaks dependencies:
>
> > root@test:/# apt-get install build-essential
> > The following packages have unmet dependencies:
> > build-essential : Depends: libc6-dev but it is not going to be installed or
> > libc-dev
> > Depends: g++ (>= 4:4.4.3) but it is not going to be installed
> > E: Broken packages

Fine for me.

$ apt-cache policy libc6-dev
libc6-dev:
Installed: 2.11.3-3
Candidate: 2.11.3-3
Version table:
*** 2.11.3-3 0
500 http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/ squeeze-updates/main i386 Packages
100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
2.11.3-2 0
500 http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/ squeeze/main i386 Packages

$ apt-cache policy g++
g++:
Installed: 4:4.4.5-1
Candidate: 4:4.4.5-1
Version table:
*** 4:4.4.5-1 0
500 http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/ squeeze/main i386 Packages
100 /var/lib/dpkg/status

> > root@test:/etc# apt-get install libc6-i386
> > ...
> > libc6-i386 : Depends: libc6 (= 2.11.3-2) but 2.11.3-3 is to be installed

Where does your libc6-i386 come from? It doesn't appear in the
archives for me.

# apt-get install libc6-i386
Reading package lists... Done
Building dependency tree
Reading state information... Done
Package libc6-i386 is not available, but is referred to by another package.
This may mean that the package is missing, has been obsoleted, or
is only available from another source

E: Package 'libc6-i386' has no installation candidate

I have libc6-i686 installed.

> Now this is odd because squeeze (stable) is only supposed to be
> installing 2.11.3-2:

True yesterday. Today 2.11.3-3 is in the released archive. I think
you caught an archive in update transition. That shouldn't be a
problem if the mirror is being updated using the proper upgrade
scripts. But if they are using something like rsync unscripted then
it might happen. Try it again or change mirrors. I bet it will work
now.

Bob

Problem Installing libc6 (eglibc) from netboot image
 

On Feb 18, 2012, at 12:16 AM, Bob Proulx wrote:

> Chris Hiestand wrote:
>> It seems that during a preseeded installation today my squeeze VM
>> installed a proposed update when it shouldn't have:
>
> Or did you simply catch an archive in the middle of being updated?
> That shouldn't happen but depends upon the mirror you are using.


The problem turned out to be caused by my missing the squeeze-updates
entries in sources.list. It was just never noticeable until this update.


>>> root@test:/etc# apt-get install libc6-i386
>>> ...
>>> libc6-i386 : Depends: libc6 (= 2.11.3-2) but 2.11.3-3 is to be installed
>
> Where does your libc6-i386 come from? It doesn't appear in the
> archives for me.


That's because you're running i386 arch. I was on an amd64 machine.


Thanks,
Chris


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Problem Installing libc6 (eglibc) from netboot image
 

Chris Hiestand wrote:
> Bob Proulx wrote:
> > Chris Hiestand wrote:
> >> It seems that during a preseeded installation today my squeeze VM
> >> installed a proposed update when it shouldn't have:
> >
> > Or did you simply catch an archive in the middle of being updated?
> > That shouldn't happen but depends upon the mirror you are using.
>
> The problem turned out to be caused by my missing the squeeze-updates
> entries in sources.list. It was just never noticeable until this update.

Interesting. Yes for whatever reason that update appears in squeeze-updates.

$ apt-cache policy libc6-i386
libc6-i386:
Installed: (none)
Candidate: 2.11.3-3
Version table:
2.11.3-3 0
500 http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/ squeeze-updates/main amd64 Packages
2.11.3-2 0
500 http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/ squeeze/main amd64 Packages

> That's because you're running i386 arch. I was on an amd64 machine.

That makes a large difference!

Out of curiosity, what are you using libc6-i386 for on your amd64
machine?

Debian biarch support isn't multiarch and is pretty poor. I realize
that poor doesn't mean broken. It just means poor. It is missing the
full package system behind it. I find it unsuitable for my use. I
avoid it. Instead I do the chroot thing to run a 32-bit chroot on my
64-bit machines that need it. Then I get full apt capability and can
install anything and can manage the system normally. Although the
chroot is more overhead to set up initially. Other people might use a
vserver. Other people might use a full VM.

But I acknowledge that installing the current x86 libs on a 64-bit
machine may be what I would brand a "quick and dirty" way to support
doing something. Just wondering what people find useful there? Since
I am pretty happy with a native 64-bit system these days. The
previous problems of Adobe Flash and Sun Java and other 32-bit binary
blobs have mostly been mitigated.

Bob

Problem Installing libc6 (eglibc) from netboot image
 

On Feb 23, 2012, at 1:43 PM, Bob Proulx wrote:

>> That's because you're running i386 arch. I was on an amd64 machine.
>
> That makes a large difference!
>
> Out of curiosity, what are you using libc6-i386 for on your amd64
> machine?

To run 32-bit apps. When I need to build a 32-bit app I just switch to a
32-bit machine or VM. I've had to support several 32-bit apps in the past
and present including:
skype
acrobat reader
adobe flash player
(and a handful of other more custom apps)

Usually the "quick and dirty" solution is just enough to get these apps running
on an amd64 machine. Fortunately a lot of these apps have moved to 64-bit
architecture, so the "quick and dirty" solution is less useful; just when
Debian is finally capable of doing things right. However I have a feeling
multi-arch will be useful in the future.

I plan to revisit this when it's time to upgrade to wheezy stable.

-Chris

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Problem Installing libc6 (eglibc) from netboot image
 

Chris Hiestand wrote:
> Bob Proulx wrote:
> > Out of curiosity, what are you using libc6-i386 for on your amd64
> > machine?
>
> To run 32-bit apps. When I need to build a 32-bit app I just switch to a
> 32-bit machine or VM. I've had to support several 32-bit apps in the past
> and present including:
> skype

You realize that skype is one of those evil applications! A kitten
dies every time another user signs up for it. :-)

> acrobat reader
> adobe flash player
> (and a handful of other more custom apps)

Those used to be very problematic on anything other than 32-bit. They
seem to be working okay in 64-bit native at the moment. Might change
at any time. There are many good native PDF readers available. Flash
is still iffy. Gnash works okay but isn't 100% yet. I still hate
flash sites due to problems with flash even on its native platform.

I had been using a chroot for those 32-bit applications. But not
currently needing one for any of those reasons now.

> Usually the "quick and dirty" solution is just enough to get these
> apps running on an amd64 machine. Fortunately a lot of these apps
> have moved to 64-bit architecture, so the "quick and dirty" solution
> is less useful; just when Debian is finally capable of doing things
> right. However I have a feeling multi-arch will be useful in the
> future.

I am not looking forward to multiarch. I think it is going to be more
trouble than it is worth. It sounds simple in concept. But the
implementation leads to many tradeoffs and compromises. For anyone
who doesn't want multiarch it is going to introduce problems and
overhead that they don't need.

> I plan to revisit this when it's time to upgrade to wheezy stable.

Good deal.

Bob

Problem Installing libc6 (eglibc) from netboot image
 

Unfortunately I don't have much choice in supporting these apps: both because users want them and because they work better than their non-evil competition. I wish gnash was better, but in my experience it's a poor substitute. I'm not sure, but I am pretty sure that no PDF reader other than Acrobat even comes close to supporting the full PDF standard (and a nasty mess the standard is: I don't really blame other authors).

Surprisingly, 32-bit flash in a 64-bit wrapper worked great for my users during the time when Adobe had no official 64-bit support. Here's a short write-up of what I did: http://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2010/06/msg00849.html

Similarly, I've had no problems running 32-bit Acrobat on a 64-bit system in ~2 years. Do you know of any issues off-hand that I should be concerned about?

I actually don't know why skype is evil. I just googled it, but I'd be interested in hearing why you think skype is evil.

Thanks for your take on multiarch, I will keep an eye on it :-)

-Chris


On Feb 23, 2012, at 5:33 PM, Bob Proulx wrote:

> Chris Hiestand wrote:
>> Bob Proulx wrote:
>>> Out of curiosity, what are you using libc6-i386 for on your amd64
>>> machine?
>>
>> To run 32-bit apps. When I need to build a 32-bit app I just switch to a
>> 32-bit machine or VM. I've had to support several 32-bit apps in the past
>> and present including:
>> skype
>
> You realize that skype is one of those evil applications! A kitten
> dies every time another user signs up for it. :-)
>
>> acrobat reader
>> adobe flash player
>> (and a handful of other more custom apps)
>
> Those used to be very problematic on anything other than 32-bit. They
> seem to be working okay in 64-bit native at the moment. Might change
> at any time. There are many good native PDF readers available. Flash
> is still iffy. Gnash works okay but isn't 100% yet. I still hate
> flash sites due to problems with flash even on its native platform.
>
> I had been using a chroot for those 32-bit applications. But not
> currently needing one for any of those reasons now.
>
>> Usually the "quick and dirty" solution is just enough to get these
>> apps running on an amd64 machine. Fortunately a lot of these apps
>> have moved to 64-bit architecture, so the "quick and dirty" solution
>> is less useful; just when Debian is finally capable of doing things
>> right. However I have a feeling multi-arch will be useful in the
>> future.
>
> I am not looking forward to multiarch. I think it is going to be more
> trouble than it is worth. It sounds simple in concept. But the
> implementation leads to many tradeoffs and compromises. For anyone
> who doesn't want multiarch it is going to introduce problems and
> overhead that they don't need.
>
>> I plan to revisit this when it's time to upgrade to wheezy stable.
>
> Good deal.
>
> Bob


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Problem Installing libc6 (eglibc) from netboot image
 

On Jo, 23 feb 12, 18:33:13, Bob Proulx wrote:
>
> You realize that skype is one of those evil applications! A kitten
> dies every time another user signs up for it. :-)

I'd be very happy to know of any real alternative that can do:

- sound + video
- NAT traversal
- support for Linux, Windows and Mac OS X

Thanks,
Andrei
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Problem Installing libc6 (eglibc) from netboot image
 

Andrei POPESCU wrote:
> Bob Proulx wrote:
> > You realize that skype is one of those evil applications! A kitten
> > dies every time another user signs up for it. :-)
>
> I'd be very happy to know of any real alternative that can do:
>
> - sound + video
> - NAT traversal
> - support for Linux, Windows and Mac OS X

I have successfully used Ekiga cross platform for all of the above.
But I accept that it isn't an equivalent to Skype. It probably won't
meet other not specified requirements to call it a "real alternative".
But as with many things being free(dom) software has advantages too.

But Ekiga does meet your specific points of sound + video and it does
to NAT traversal and it worked successfully for me between my Debian
GNU/Linux machine and a MS-XP machine. And it is packaged for Debian.

http://ekiga.org/

But to frame the date correctly I used it solidly off and on for
several months through the summer and fall of 2009. I haven't been
using it recently. But it worked awesomely for me then.

Bob