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Old 09-27-2011, 11:42 AM
Camaleón
 
Default iceweasel based on firefox 6.0 for squeeze

On Mon, 26 Sep 2011 18:43:08 +0100, Brian wrote:

> On Mon 26 Sep 2011 at 14:23:12 +0000, Camaleón wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 26 Sep 2011 14:33:31 +0100, Brian wrote:
>>
>> > It is clear we have diametrically opposite views, so best leave it
>> > there.
>>
>> How can be that?
>>
>> I mean, how can you consider ClamAV needs to be up-to-date (I mean the
>> program, not the firm files as firm files to detect malware are
>> automatically updated regardless the version of the program) and
>> Iceweasel not? You can't go so far with Iceweasel 2.x on these days...
>
> I have no particular view on clamav's inclusion in squeeze-updates and
> only mentioned it because it is given as an example of a package which
> fits criterion 4.

(...)

Okay, but I hope you've noted that packages that fall in there (squeeze-
updates) are for many different reasons, not just one and while clamav is
put as an example of point 4) it contradicts with point 1)

By following that same logic, Iceweasel can fit into point 1) and just
for that be eligible to be there.

Do you understand now what I try to say?

> If you want me say Iceweasel 6.0 has more features and is more
> up-to-date than Iceweasel 3.0.6 on Lenny you can have it, but being
> up-to-date doesn't count for stable-updates and Iceweasel 3.0.6 is no
> less useful now in its own terms and in the context of keeping Lenny
> stable than the day it was installed.

So, do you still think that Iceweasel does not fit for point 1)?

> The Stable Release Manager has something to say on the policy for
> stable-updates at
>
> http://raphaelhertzog.com/2011/06/10/people-behind-debian-philipp-kern/

Precisely (I guess you refer to his reponse to "The policy for stable
updates have changed over time. Can you summarize what kind of updates
are allowed nowadays?" question).

He first states that things are changing and stable-updates is becoming
more flexible over the time, which is my main point.

To be sincere, I think the main (only?) reason for not having Mozilla
products in there is just for what Sven said earlier on this thread:
architecture build issues, which being a merely techical reason I can
fully understand.

Greetings,

--
Camaleón


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Old 09-27-2011, 02:49 PM
Camaleón
 
Default iceweasel based on firefox 6.0 for squeeze

On Mon, 26 Sep 2011 13:45:28 +1000, Scott Ferguson wrote:

> On 26/09/11 04:51, Allan Wind wrote:
>> On 2011-09-25 17:56:32, Brian wrote:
>>> The squeeze version of Iceweasel doesn't lose its usefulness because
>>> there is a later version out.
>>
>> The environment changes relative to a frozen browser which reduce the
>> usefulness to me.
>
> ?
>
> What changes in the internet render the default Squeeze Iceweasel
> unusable other than the latest extensions? We're a long way from HTML5
> yet.
>
> NOTE: warning from webservers based on version numbers doesn't count.

(...)

<joke mode on>

Ah, Scott, Scott... the web turns into a lonely place when you can't play
"Angry Birds" online and you need an html5 based browser to launch those
softy balls of feather to destroy the green pig houses.

</joke mode off>

Greetings,
(from the land of "html5", where the "canvas" element lies...)

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Camaleón


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Old 09-27-2011, 06:22 PM
Brian
 
Default iceweasel based on firefox 6.0 for squeeze

On Tue 27 Sep 2011 at 11:42:17 +0000, Camaleón wrote:

> So, do you still think that Iceweasel does not fit for point 1)?

There might be a demand to get it in on that basis - but it would only
be for the birds.


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Old 09-27-2011, 07:17 PM
Steven Rosenberg
 
Default iceweasel based on firefox 6.0 for squeeze

On Sat, Sep 24, 2011 at 6:02 PM, Rob Hurle <rob1940@gmail.com> wrote:


Dear Peter,



On 25 September 2011 10:04, Peter Tenenbaum <peter.g.tenenbaum@gmail.com> wrote:

> I would like to migrate to firefox 6.0, but I'd like to do it using the

> debian iceweasel distribution.* Can anyone tell me how to go about setting

> that up?



Try the following:



http://mozilla.debian.net/



I used it and found it very helpful.



I also use the Mozilla Debian APT archive in Stable for both Iceweasel and Icedove. This is exactly what I want: The stable base that works with my hardware plus newer versions of what for me are critical applications (web browser, mail client).



I also have LibreOffice from Backports.
 
Old 09-28-2011, 12:45 AM
Scott Ferguson
 
Default iceweasel based on firefox 6.0 for squeeze

On 28/09/11 00:49, � wrote:
> On Mon, 26 Sep 2011 13:45:28 +1000, Scott Ferguson wrote:
>
>> On 26/09/11 04:51, Allan Wind wrote:
>>> On 2011-09-25 17:56:32, Brian wrote:
>>>> The squeeze version of Iceweasel doesn't lose its usefulness
>>>> because there is a later version out.
>>>
>>> The environment changes relative to a frozen browser which reduce
>>> the usefulness to me.
>>
>> ?
>>
>> What changes in the internet render the default Squeeze Iceweasel
>> unusable other than the latest extensions? We're a long way from
>> HTML5 yet.
>>
>> NOTE: warning from webservers based on version numbers doesn't
>> count.
>
> (...)
>
> <joke mode on>
>
> Ah, Scott, Scott... the web turns into a lonely place when you can't
> play "Angry Birds" online and you need an html5 based browser to
> launch those softy balls of feather to destroy the green pig houses.
>
> </joke mode off>
>
> Greetings, (from the land of "html5", where the "canvas" element
> lies...)


"Angry Birds" belongs in the same bucket as Silverlight and Fffacebook.
Lots of people use and want them - just like lots of people believe in
little green people in flying saucers... oh, hang on - it's the same people.

Cheers


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Old 09-28-2011, 11:25 AM
Camaleón
 
Default iceweasel based on firefox 6.0 for squeeze

On Wed, 28 Sep 2011 10:45:22 +1000, Scott Ferguson wrote:

> On 28/09/11 00:49, � wrote:

(...)

>>> What changes in the internet render the default Squeeze Iceweasel
>>> unusable other than the latest extensions? We're a long way from HTML5
>>> yet.
>>>
>>> NOTE: warning from webservers based on version numbers doesn't count.
>>
>> (...)
>>
>> <joke mode on>
>>
>> Ah, Scott, Scott... the web turns into a lonely place when you can't
>> play "Angry Birds" online and you need an html5 based browser to launch
>> those softy balls of feather to destroy the green pig houses.
>>
>> </joke mode off>
>>
>> Greetings, (from the land of "html5", where the "canvas" element
>> lies...)
>
>
> "Angry Birds" belongs in the same bucket as Silverlight and Fffacebook.

How can be that? AB is a game, SL is a plugin and FB is a social network.

> Lots of people use and want them - just like lots of people believe in
> little green people in flying saucers... oh, hang on - it's the same
> people.

Sigh... I'm afraid you tried to connect the points by following the
numbers in the wrong order.

Greetings,

--
Camaleón


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Old 09-29-2011, 06:24 AM
Scott Ferguson
 
Default iceweasel based on firefox 6.0 for squeeze

On 28/09/11 21:25, � wrote:
> On Wed, 28 Sep 2011 10:45:22 +1000, Scott Ferguson wrote:
>
>> On 28/09/11 00:49, � wrote:
>
> (...)
>
>>>> What changes in the internet render the default Squeeze Iceweasel
>>>> unusable other than the latest extensions? We're a long way from HTML5
>>>> yet.
>>>>
>>>> NOTE: warning from webservers based on version numbers doesn't count.
>>>
>>> (...)
>>>
>>> <joke mode on>
>>>
>>> Ah, Scott, Scott... the web turns into a lonely place when you can't
>>> play "Angry Birds" online and you need an html5 based browser to launch
>>> those softy balls of feather to destroy the green pig houses.
>>>
>>> </joke mode off>
>>>
>>> Greetings, (from the land of "html5", where the "canvas" element
>>> lies...)

Are you serious? Maybe you should warn the w3.org they need to update
their documentation?

>>
>>
>> "Angry Birds" belongs in the same bucket as Silverlight and Fffacebook.
>
> How can be that? AB is a game, SL is a plugin and FB is a social network.

I have a special (Circular Repurposing And Purging) bucket, (for all
types of rubbish), like Facebook, Silverlight, and Angry Birds, there's
even copies of MS Vista and ME in there.

You put Angry Birds, HTML 5, and the Canvas element in the same
sentence, as if they're all related..... and you look at me like I'm a
dog that's just been shown a card trick?

How can that be?
A. the Canvas element has been supported by Apple's Webkit since 2004.
B. HTML 5 is not a finalised standard *yet*.


There are two versions of the Angry Birds game.
The on developed for Apple. It uses the Canvas element.
HTML 5 is not a standard yet. When it is, it will most likely support
Apple's Canvas Element to some degree.

The other, more recent, version, was developed for Google. Part of the
development contract was that portions be exclusive "for the Google
Chrome Browser". It uses the Canvas Element - which is supported by some
browsers. It will never be fully supported by all browsers - even when
HTML 5 is finalized (by design).

>
>> Lots of people use and want them - just like lots of people believe in
>> little green people in flying saucers... oh, hang on - it's the same
>> people.
>
> Sigh... I'm afraid you tried to connect the points by following the
> numbers in the wrong order.

When you find:-
<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 5.0//EN">
as a tag, then you can start testing browsers for HTML 5 support.

Until then - we're just trying to nail smoke to the wall.

Cheers

Refs:-
http://www.w3.org/TR/html5/
http://www.whatwg.org/specs/web-apps/current-work/multipage/introduction.html#is-this-html5?


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Old 09-29-2011, 01:37 PM
Camaleón
 
Default iceweasel based on firefox 6.0 for squeeze

On Thu, 29 Sep 2011 16:24:54 +1000, Scott Ferguson wrote:

> On 28/09/11 21:25, � wrote:

(...)

>>>> <joke mode on>
>>>>
>>>> Ah, Scott, Scott... the web turns into a lonely place when you can't
>>>> play "Angry Birds" online and you need an html5 based browser to
>>>> launch those softy balls of feather to destroy the green pig houses.
>>>>
>>>> </joke mode off>
>>>>
>>>> Greetings, (from the land of "html5", where the "canvas" element
>>>> lies...)
>
> Are you serious? Maybe you should warn the w3.org they need to update
> their documentation?

Serious about what?

>>> "Angry Birds" belongs in the same bucket as Silverlight and
>>> Fffacebook.
>>
>> How can be that? AB is a game, SL is a plugin and FB is a social
>> network.
>
> I have a special (Circular Repurposing And Purging) bucket, (for all
> types of rubbish), like Facebook, Silverlight, and Angry Birds, there's
> even copies of MS Vista and ME in there.

Consider enlarging your bucket, as this is only the principle of the new
era.

> You put Angry Birds, HTML 5, and the Canvas element in the same
> sentence, as if they're all related..... and you look at me like I'm a
> dog that's just been shown a card trick?

Yes, because they are all related.

> How can that be?
> A. the Canvas element has been supported by Apple's Webkit since 2004.

I also do read the wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canvas_element

But this is not related to Firefox nor its ability to render html5 code.

> B. HTML 5 is not a finalised standard *yet*.

It's a working draft. It seems that you don't have a minimal knowledge of
how W3C manages its specs.

> There are two versions of the Angry Birds game.

What the hell are you talking about? I was referring to this:

http://chrome.angrybirds.com/

> The on developed for Apple. It uses the Canvas element. HTML 5 is not a
> standard yet. When it is, it will most likely support Apple's Canvas
> Element to some degree.
>
> The other, more recent, version, was developed for Google. Part of the
> development contract was that portions be exclusive "for the Google
> Chrome Browser". It uses the Canvas Element - which is supported by some
> browsers. It will never be fully supported by all browsers - even when
> HTML 5 is finalized (by design).

Okay, so you were not aware that it can be played with any browser that
supports the canvas element. Fine. Now you know.

>>> Lots of people use and want them - just like lots of people believe in
>>> little green people in flying saucers... oh, hang on - it's the same
>>> people.
>>
>> Sigh... I'm afraid you tried to connect the points by following the
>> numbers in the wrong order.
>
> When you find:-
> <!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 5.0//EN"> as a tag, then you can
> start testing browsers for HTML 5 support.
>
> Until then - we're just trying to nail smoke to the wall.

(...)

That's simply not true.

Html is flexible and polivalent enough to start using part of a wowking
draft spec "now" while keeping compatibility with html4/xhtml. Wake up!

Greetings,

--
Camaleón


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