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Old 08-11-2008, 02:47 PM
kj
 
Default State of 64bit desktop

Hi guys,

At work I'm starting to push the limits of my RAM with MySQL/InnoDB on
my workstation (I do dev/testing on my workstation). I have 64bit
hardware, capable of taking 8gb memory.


What I'm worried about is the tools I use. In particular, I need a
browser with all the usual suspects working properly: flash and java
(unfortunately some of the tools I need to use at work are written in
these abominable languages). Does anyone do heavy java and flash usage
under 64bit Debian (I'm running Lenny)? One tool in particular I'm
forced to use is the Raritan KVM interface. It's horrible.


Is this move viable or should I rather invest in a second box (won't
come for free). I don't want to mess around with 32bit chroots - did
that before and I didn't like it one bit.


Thanks
--kj


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Old 08-11-2008, 07:37 PM
"Stackpole, Chris"
 
Default State of 64bit desktop

> From: kj [mailto:koffiejunkielistlurker@koffiejunkie.za.net]
> Subject: State of 64bit desktop
>
> Hi guys,
>
> At work I'm starting to push the limits of my RAM with MySQL/InnoDB on
> my workstation (I do dev/testing on my workstation). I have 64bit
> hardware, capable of taking 8gb memory.
>
> What I'm worried about is the tools I use. In particular, I need a
> browser with all the usual suspects working properly: flash and java
> (unfortunately some of the tools I need to use at work are written in
> these abominable languages). Does anyone do heavy java and flash
usage
> under 64bit Debian (I'm running Lenny)? One tool in particular I'm
> forced to use is the Raritan KVM interface. It's horrible.
>
> Is this move viable or should I rather invest in a second box (won't
> come for free). I don't want to mess around with 32bit chroots - did
> that before and I didn't like it one bit.
>
> Thanks
> --kj

Fraid that this might be a "mileage may vary" type of question...

Here is my 2 cents though.

I had horrible problems with Debian Etch and 64bit. 64bit Debian Lenny
has been /brilliant/ but I have only worked with server class
testing/development; I have not had a chance to test Lenny on a Desktop
64bit system. One guy I know does use a 64bit Desktop with Java/flash
but that is with Ubuntu Hardy so I don't know how great the difference
will be for you.

My personal suggestion, if you can do it, would be to give it a shot and
then report what you find back to the Debian Dev team before Lenny goes
stable. It would probably help them out quite a bit and help generate
more interest in the 64bit world. Of course not everyone has the
time/ability to do that* and if you are one of those people then my
suggestion would be to wait till Lenny is released and ask again. At the
very least, I should be able to respond**.


Have fun!
~S~

*Unfortunately, I have to raise my hand here...for now at least. I keep
hoping for some spare time. :-(

**We have an upgrade path planned to move a bunch of production systems
to 64bit once Lenny goes stable. As we do that I have a development
desktop system that is 64bit capable (currently running 32bit Debian)
that I can at least tell you how it works out for me. Just give me a
couple weeks for migration. :-D


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Old 08-11-2008, 07:42 PM
Shachar Or
 
Default State of 64bit desktop

On Monday 11 August 2008 17:47, kj wrote:
> Hi guys,
>
> At work I'm starting to push the limits of my RAM with MySQL/InnoDB on
> my workstation (I do dev/testing on my workstation). I have 64bit
> hardware, capable of taking 8gb memory.
>
> What I'm worried about is the tools I use. In particular, I need a
> browser with all the usual suspects working properly: flash and java
> (unfortunately some of the tools I need to use at work are written in
> these abominable languages). Does anyone do heavy java and flash usage
> under 64bit Debian (I'm running Lenny)? One tool in particular I'm
> forced to use is the Raritan KVM interface. It's horrible.
>
> Is this move viable or should I rather invest in a second box (won't
> come for free). I don't want to mess around with 32bit chroots - did
> that before and I didn't like it one bit.

No problem with flashplugin-nonfree here in amd64 etch except flash except
nspluginwrapper takes a whole lot more cpu than I would like it to.
>
> Thanks
> --kj

--
Shachar Or | שחר אור
http://ox.freeallweb.org/


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Old 08-11-2008, 07:51 PM
"elijah r."
 
Default State of 64bit desktop

> What I'm worried about is the tools I use. In particular, I need a browser
> with all the usual suspects working properly: flash and java (unfortunately
> some of the tools I need to use at work are written in these abominable
> languages). Does anyone do heavy java and flash usage under 64bit Debian
> (I'm running Lenny)? One tool in particular I'm forced to use is the
> Raritan KVM interface. It's horrible.

I switched my dual-core Lenny desktop to an amd64 kernel last week
without any issue. I have used the non-free flash and java browser
plugins with Iceweasel. I haven't noticed any issues with those
programs, but I have not used them heavily. I have definitely noticed
faster system performance overall.

-Elijah
--
http://elijahr.blogspot.com/


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Old 08-11-2008, 07:55 PM
Jochen Schulz
 
Default State of 64bit desktop

kj:
>
> What I'm worried about is the tools I use. In particular, I need a
> browser with all the usual suspects working properly: flash and java
> (unfortunately some of the tools I need to use at work are written in
> these abominable languages). Does anyone do heavy java and flash usage
> under 64bit Debian (I'm running Lenny)?

Not really. Flash works fine here (on a sid system using
nspluginwrapper) most of the time, but sometimes flash objects become
blank and I have to restart Iceweasel. I don't use Java at all (at least
not in the browser.

Otherwise, everything works really great. Debian on AMD64 is of the same
quality as on i386.

> Is this move viable or should I rather invest in a second box (won't
> come for free). I don't want to mess around with 32bit chroots - did
> that before and I didn't like it one bit.

What exactly was so bad? I played around with schroot (I don't have an
urgent need for chroots) and it looks really fine. If you write a few
tiny shell scripts to automate the most common tasks (launch browser
from chroot etc.), you can probably forget that you are forced to use a
chroot at all.

J.
--
I am not scared of death but terrified of people in Tommy Hilfiger
sweatshirts.
[Agree] [Disagree]
<http://www.slowlydownward.com/NODATA/data_enter2.html>
 
Old 08-11-2008, 08:49 PM
Alex Samad
 
Default State of 64bit desktop

On Mon, Aug 11, 2008 at 03:47:41PM +0100, kj wrote:
> Hi guys,
>
> At work I'm starting to push the limits of my RAM with MySQL/InnoDB on
> my workstation (I do dev/testing on my workstation). I have 64bit
> hardware, capable of taking 8gb memory.
best place to ask is the amd64 mailing list

>
> What I'm worried about is the tools I use. In particular, I need a
> browser with all the usual suspects working properly: flash and java
> (unfortunately some of the tools I need to use at work are written in
> these abominable languages). Does anyone do heavy java and flash usage
> under 64bit Debian (I'm running Lenny)? One tool in particular I'm
> forced to use is the Raritan KVM interface. It's horrible.

flash there is 2 options the non-free 64B plugin, I had not success
with that, with the nwrapper basically a 64 -> 32 thunker for the
non-free flash program I haven't had any problems at all

Java this is going to be your biggest problem, there is no Sun 64B java
plugin, the nwrapper doesn't work for 32b java. There is gij and gcj
and the new open java (can't remember its name), its from Redhat and has
recently been certified by sun, that would be your best bet.

Options for java, chroot you have ruled out (it worked seemlessly for
me), install 32bit iceweasel (you can install all the 32bit apps on the
64b machine - you just need the right libraries).

Another option install amd64, virtualbox and install 32b on virtualbox
run the 64 b on vt and 32b on vt8

Alex

Note I presume you mean java and not java script

>
> Is this move viable or should I rather invest in a second box (won't
> come for free). I don't want to mess around with 32bit chroots - did
> that before and I didn't like it one bit.
>
> Thanks
> --kj
>
>
> --
> To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-REQUEST@lists.debian.org with a
> subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster@lists.debian.org
>
>

--
"I'm not the expert on how the Iraqi people think, because I live in America, where it's nice and safe and secure."

- George W. Bush
09/23/2004
Washington, DC
 
Old 08-11-2008, 11:46 PM
"s. keeling"
 
Default State of 64bit desktop

kj <koffiejunkielistlurker@koffiejunkie.za.net>:
> Hi guys,

Not to mention other people? :-|

> At work I'm starting to push the limits of my RAM with MySQL/InnoDB on
> my workstation (I do dev/testing on my workstation). I have 64bit
> hardware, capable of taking 8gb memory.
>
> What I'm worried about is the tools I use. In particular, I need a
> browser with all the usual suspects working properly: flash and java

I've had both Lenny and Sidux installed on my Sparc U30 64 bit. I
can't guarantee that that shite runs well on it, but stock Debian
appears to run fine. Now, I'm fiddling with Splack (Slackware for
Sparc), which is interesting. It's very happy with NetBSD. fwiw.


--
Any technology distinguishable from magic is insufficiently advanced.
(*) http://blinkynet.net/comp/uip5.html Linux Counter #80292
- - http://www.faqs.org/rfcs/rfc1855.html Please, don't Cc: me.


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Old 08-12-2008, 09:07 AM
Johann Spies
 
Default State of 64bit desktop

On Mon, Aug 11, 2008 at 03:47:41PM +0100, kj wrote:
> Is this move viable or should I rather invest in a second box (won't
> come for free). I don't want to mess around with 32bit chroots - did
> that before and I didn't like it one bit.

I have 64-bit Debian on 2 PC's and Ubuntu-64-bit on a laptop. With
the ia32-libaries installed works well except on one Debian PC where I
have problems with nspluginwrapper. The flash-plugin sometimes works
and then stops working. I became a little frustrated and then started
to use a 32-bit system installed in VirtualBox so when I need a
flashplugin on that system I use the vbox-32-bit version.

On all my 64-bit systems I can use Googleearth and Skype (although the
sound is sometime problematic). I did not have any java-related
problems with the browsers on the 64-bit systems.

Regards
Johann
--
Johann Spies Telefoon: 021-808 4036
Informasietegnologie, Universiteit van Stellenbosch

"And he spake a parable unto them to this end, that men
ought always to pray, and not to faint;"
Luke 18:1


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Old 08-12-2008, 09:25 AM
Aniruddha
 
Default State of 64bit desktop

On Mon, 2008-08-11 at 15:47 +0100, kj wrote:
> Hi guys,
>
> At work I'm starting to push the limits of my RAM with MySQL/InnoDB on
> my workstation (I do dev/testing on my workstation). I have 64bit
> hardware, capable of taking 8gb memory.
>
> What I'm worried about is the tools I use. In particular, I need a
> browser with all the usual suspects working properly: flash and java
> (unfortunately some of the tools I need to use at work are written in
> these abominable languages). Does anyone do heavy java and flash usage
> under 64bit Debian (I'm running Lenny)? One tool in particular I'm
> forced to use is the Raritan KVM interface. It's horrible.
>
> Is this move viable or should I rather invest in a second box (won't
> come for free). I don't want to mess around with 32bit chroots - did
> that before and I didn't like it one bit.
>
> Thanks
> --kj
>
>

How much memory do you have? 32-bit Linux support up to 64 GB of memory
and 32 processors.

--
Regards,


Aniruddha



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Old 08-12-2008, 10:36 AM
Johann Spies
 
Default State of 64bit desktop

On Tue, Aug 12, 2008 at 11:25:26AM +0200, Aniruddha wrote:

> How much memory do you have? 32-bit Linux support up to 64 GB of memory
> and 32 processors.

Only if you use a PAE-enabled kernel.

In my experience it is better to use 64-bit when you have memory > 4G.

Regards
Johann

--
Johann Spies Telefoon: 021-808 4036
Informasietegnologie, Universiteit van Stellenbosch

"And he spake a parable unto them to this end, that men
ought always to pray, and not to faint;"
Luke 18:1


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