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Old 07-20-2008, 06:11 PM
"Kelly Clowers"
 
Default Firefox/Iceweasel 3: agony of the snail

On Sun, Jul 20, 2008 at 10:44 AM, Florian Kulzer
<florian.kulzer+debian@icfo.es> wrote:
>
> OK, our mini-survey so far:
>
> nvidia driver using nvidia's RenderAccel: fine (Hugo, Ron)
> radeon driver with XAA: fine (Bill)
>
> My experience with Intel 82Q963/Q965 and the Xorg intel driver:
>
> with EXA: not as bad as what Jim describes, but slow enough to seriously
> deteriorate the browsing experience
>
> with XAA: generally quite fast, only web sites with excessive use of
> background images slow it down noticeably, but not unbearably
>
> Jim, if you have an intel card and use EXA (the default these days) then
> a switch to XAA will improve your browsing experience significantly.

I have found EXA to work very well with the Radeon drivers (r300/r400).


Cheers,
Kelly Clowers


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Old 07-20-2008, 07:15 PM
Ron Johnson
 
Default Firefox/Iceweasel 3: agony of the snail

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
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On 07/20/08 12:44, Florian Kulzer wrote:
[snip]
>
> OK, our mini-survey so far:
>
> nvidia driver using nvidia's RenderAccel: fine (Hugo, Ron)

Actually, I do *not* have RenderAccel enabled.

$ grep 'Accel|XAA|EXA' /var/log/Xorg.0.log
(II) NVIDIA(0): NVIDIA 3D Acceleration Architecture Initialized
(WW) NVIDIA(0): Option "XAANoOffscreenPixmaps" is not used

- --
Ron Johnson, Jr.
Jefferson LA USA

"Kittens give Morbo gas. In lighter news, the city of New New
York is doomed."
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Old 07-20-2008, 07:18 PM
Ron Johnson
 
Default Firefox/Iceweasel 3: agony of the snail

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On 07/20/08 13:01, Nick Lidakis wrote:
> Ron Johnson wrote:
>
>>
>> Most of you will yawn, and think, "there he goes again", but this
>> why I don't like display managers.
>
> Can you elaborate? With a display manager one cannot kill X to make new
> changes, like the aforementioned libraries, to take effect?

According to Carl's experience, no. Maybe he did something wrong?

- --
Ron Johnson, Jr.
Jefferson LA USA

"Kittens give Morbo gas. In lighter news, the city of New New
York is doomed."
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Old 07-21-2008, 01:12 AM
Nate Bargmann
 
Default Firefox/Iceweasel 3: agony of the snail

* Florian Kulzer <florian.kulzer+debian@icfo.es> [2008 Jul 20 13:02 -0500]:
> On Sun, Jul 20, 2008 at 09:59:22 -0700, Bill Wohler wrote:
> > Nope.
> >
> > $ grep -B1 -A4 'drivers/' /var/log/Xorg.0.log
> > (II) LoadModule: "radeon"
>
> [...]
>
> > (==) RADEON(0): Using XAA acceleration architecture
> > (II) RADEON(0): Using XFree86 Acceleration Architecture (XAA)
> > (II) RADEON(0): Acceleration enabled
> >
> > It sounds like others are OK too. The good news is that once you get
> > your X drivers straightened out, your entire UI experience will
> > probably improve dramatically.
>
> OK, our mini-survey so far:
>
> nvidia driver using nvidia's RenderAccel: fine (Hugo, Ron)
> radeon driver with XAA: fine (Bill)

I'm not seeing the IW problems and I'm using the Xorg radeon driver as
well:

$ grep -B1 -A4 'drivers/' /var/log/Xorg.0.log
(II) LoadModule: "radeon"
(II) Loading /usr/lib/xorg/modules/drivers//radeon_drv.so
(II) Module radeon: vendor="X.Org Foundation"
compiled for 1.4.2, module version = 4.3.0
Module class: X.Org Video Driver
ABI class: X.Org Video Driver, version 2.0
$ grep 'XAA' /var/log/Xorg.0.log
(==) RADEON(0): Using XAA acceleration architecture
(II) RADEON(0): Using XFree86 Acceleration Architecture (XAA)
$

I'm also using IW3 on my T23 Thinkpad using the savage driver with no
speed issues. I believe it also uses XAA.

- Nate >>

--

"The optimist proclaims that we live in the best of all
possible worlds. The pessimist fears this is true."

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Old 07-21-2008, 01:16 AM
Nate Bargmann
 
Default Firefox/Iceweasel 3: agony of the snail

* Ron Johnson <ron.l.johnson@cox.net> [2008 Jul 20 14:20 -0500]:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> On 07/20/08 13:01, Nick Lidakis wrote:
> > Ron Johnson wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> Most of you will yawn, and think, "there he goes again", but this
> >> why I don't like display managers.
> >
> > Can you elaborate? With a display manager one cannot kill X to make new
> > changes, like the aforementioned libraries, to take effect?
>
> According to Carl's experience, no. Maybe he did something wrong?

I go into a root console and issue:

# /etc/init.d/kdm stop
# /etc/init.d/kdm start; exit

whenever X libraries, drivers, etc. are updated. Ctl-e from KDM does
not do a complete kill and restart as near as I can tell.

- Nate >>

--

"The optimist proclaims that we live in the best of all
possible worlds. The pessimist fears this is true."

Ham radio, Linux, bikes, and more: http://n0nb.us/index.html


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Old 07-21-2008, 02:30 PM
Bill Wohler
 
Default Firefox/Iceweasel 3: agony of the snail

Carl Fink <carlf@panix.com> writes:

> In my case, a reboot was required to load the new versions of about a dozen
> libraries. (Killing and restarting X did not do it.) Once I did that,
> weird rendering problems in Gecko went away. It can't hurt.

You don't have to reboot to restart the X server. You have at least
two easy methods at your disposal to do so:

1. C-A-Backspace (that's Control-Alt-Backspace to non-Emacs folks)

2. /etc/init.d/gdm restart (replace gdm with your display manager)

I perform these after logging out in order to save my session.

--
Bill Wohler <wohler@newt.com> http://www.newt.com/wohler/ GnuPG ID:610BD9AD


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Old 07-21-2008, 02:58 PM
Carl Fink
 
Default Firefox/Iceweasel 3: agony of the snail

On Mon, Jul 21, 2008 at 07:30:54AM -0700, Bill Wohler wrote:
> Carl Fink <carlf@panix.com> writes:
>
> > In my case, a reboot was required to load the new versions of about a dozen
> > libraries. (Killing and restarting X did not do it.) Once I did that,
> > weird rendering problems in Gecko went away. It can't hurt.
>
> You don't have to reboot to restart the X server. You have at least
> two easy methods at your disposal to do so:
>
> 1. C-A-Backspace (that's Control-Alt-Backspace to non-Emacs folks)
>
> 2. /etc/init.d/gdm restart (replace gdm with your display manager)

Yes, and when I mentioned "restarting X" what did you think that I meant?
#1 above, in fact.
--
Carl Fink nitpicking@nitpicking.com

Read my blog at blog.nitpicking.com. Reviews! Observations!
Stupid mistakes you can correct!


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Old 07-21-2008, 11:51 PM
Jim McCloskey
 
Default Firefox/Iceweasel 3: agony of the snail

On Sun, Jul 20, 2008 at 12:24 AM, Jim McCloskey <mcclosk@ucsc.edu>
wrote:

> An upgrade to testing this afternoon unexpectedly brought me
> Firefox/Iceweasel 3.0, which was fairly exciting. Here, though, it is
> just agonizingly slow---10-12 seconds between clicking `Bookmarks' in
> the Toolbar and the display of the menu.

Thanks very much to everyone who responded and my apologies for my own
slowness in response (many commitments yesterday).

I don't use a display-manager so the FF3 problem is unrelated to that. I
had re-booted a number of times in trying to debug this problem, so the
problem is also unrelated to that.

But it's now clear where the problem lies. I have been using
the proprietary ATI drivers (fglrx-driver, fglrx-glx, and fglrx-kernel-src
as packaged for Debian). This is because I made the mistake of buying a
('linux-ready') Thinkpad T60 with an ATI graphics adapter (the V5200) rather
than an Intel graphics adapter, and I have regretted the mistake ever since.
The proprietary ATI drivers have been a constant source of headaches and are
very buggy.

I just installed the open-source radeonhd driver instead, re-configured and
restarted X, and the sluggishness problem with FF3 and Epiphany disappeared.
So I can add to the list of fglrx-related problems that it interacts very badly
with the Gecko rendering engine used currently by FF3 and Epiphany.

Unfortunately, the radeonhd driver is still very much in development and it still
lacks many of the features that one might want in a modern video driver---no 3D
accelation, no XVideo extension, for instance.

So there are still no very good choices for linux users who have made the mistake
of buying a system which includes one of these new ATI adapters. But progress on
the radeonhd drivers seems to be fairly fast ...

Thanks again to everyone who helped,

Jim





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