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Old 07-05-2008, 04:19 AM
Neil Gunton
 
Default Using Lenny on production server?

I run a moderately busy community website, hosted on my own LAMP (Perl,
MySQL) AMD64 server, currently running Etch in a colo. I am going to go
up to the datacenter on July 16th to rebuild the server for various
reasons. This will include a complete re-install. One change I am
considering is to upgrade to Lenny. I've read that Lenny will shortly be
frozen, for possible release in September 2008, so I'm thinking that it
must be fairly "stable" (not in the formal sense, of course) at this point.


I know the conventional wisdom is to only install Stable on servers;
however I am wondering if I can temper that view with the current state
of Lenny (almost ready for move to stable) and just install it now
rather than go through a dist-upgrade later.


So: What do people think about the wisdom of running a clean install of
Lenny in a production server environment at this time? I am not a bank,
I don't need five-nines uptime, but I would just like to know if the
system is generally fairly stable and "probably" not prone to any major
upheavals at this point. Any insights there?


Thanks!

Neil


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Old 07-05-2008, 11:40 AM
Hendrik Boom
 
Default Using Lenny on production server?

On Fri, 04 Jul 2008 23:19:34 -0500, Neil Gunton wrote:

> So: What do people think about the wisdom of running a clean install of
> Lenny in a production server environment at this time? I am not a bank,
> I don't need five-nines uptime, but I would just like to know if the
> system is generally fairly stable and "probably" not prone to any major
> upheavals at this point. Any insights there?

Often, just before a code freeze for a major release, there is a flurry
of changes, some of them not well-thought-out.

-- hendrik


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Old 07-05-2008, 03:49 PM
Joe
 
Default Using Lenny on production server?

Neil Gunton wrote:
I run a moderately busy community website, hosted on my own LAMP (Perl,
MySQL) AMD64 server, currently running Etch in a colo. I am going to go
up to the datacenter on July 16th to rebuild the server for various
reasons. This will include a complete re-install. One change I am
considering is to upgrade to Lenny. I've read that Lenny will shortly be
frozen, for possible release in September 2008, so I'm thinking that it
must be fairly "stable" (not in the formal sense, of course) at this point.


I know the conventional wisdom is to only install Stable on servers;
however I am wondering if I can temper that view with the current state
of Lenny (almost ready for move to stable) and just install it now
rather than go through a dist-upgrade later.


So: What do people think about the wisdom of running a clean install of
Lenny in a production server environment at this time? I am not a bank,
I don't need five-nines uptime, but I would just like to know if the
system is generally fairly stable and "probably" not prone to any major
upheavals at this point. Any insights there?


Thanks!

Neil


Upheavals, no, bugs, mmmm... A freeze normally comes quite a long time
before release. A quick look here:


http://bugs.debian.org/release-critical/

suggests to me that Lenny is at least a year away from release,
possibly 18 months going by previous releases. Remember that Etch is
only a few months old as Stable.


I hadn't looked at this page since the last release, when the third line
was added. I do find it a little odd that Etch seems to have twice as
many bugs deemed release-critical as Lenny, though a quick glance
through them suggests that only a small proportion are likely to trouble
a small private server running on i86-32.



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Old 07-05-2008, 08:13 PM
Bob Cox
 
Default Using Lenny on production server?

On Sat, Jul 05, 2008 at 16:49:39 +0100, Joe (joe@jretrading.com) wrote:

> http://bugs.debian.org/release-critical/
>
> suggests to me that Lenny is at least a year away from release,
> possibly 18 months going by previous releases. Remember that Etch is
> only a few months old as Stable.

Etch has been stable for 15 months, released in April 2007.

http://www.uk.debian.org/News/2007/20070408

--
Bob Cox. Stoke Gifford, near Bristol, UK.
Registered user #445000 with the Linux Counter - http://counter.li.org/


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Old 07-06-2008, 06:23 AM
"Adrian Levi"
 
Default Using Lenny on production server?

2008/7/6 Bob Cox <debian-user@lists.bobcox.com>:
> On Sat, Jul 05, 2008 at 16:49:39 +0100, Joe (joe@jretrading.com) wrote:

>> possibly 18 months going by previous releases. Remember that Etch is
>> only a few months old as Stable.
>
> Etch has been stable for 15 months, released in April 2007.
> http://www.uk.debian.org/News/2007/20070408

I think the OP is referring to 'Debian' time. :-)

Adrian

--
24x7x365 != 24x7x52 Stupid or bad maths?
<erno> hm. I've lost a machine.. literally _lost_. it responds to
ping, it works completely, I just can't figure out where in my
apartment it is.


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Old 07-14-2008, 10:26 PM
Kamaraju S Kusumanchi
 
Default Using Lenny on production server?

Neil Gunton wrote:

> I run a moderately busy community website, hosted on my own LAMP (Perl,
> MySQL) AMD64 server, currently running Etch in a colo. I am going to go
> up to the datacenter on July 16th to rebuild the server for various
> reasons. This will include a complete re-install. One change I am
> considering is to upgrade to Lenny. I've read that Lenny will shortly be
> frozen, for possible release in September 2008, so I'm thinking that it
> must be fairly "stable" (not in the formal sense, of course) at this
> point.

Ask yourself this question. "Why do I need Lenny instead of Etch?" If the
answer is "I don't know. Lenny seems to have newer versions." then stick
with Etch. New versions does not mean they are good. If the answer
is "feature X is absent from package Y. This feature is needed to run the
website" then you might want Lenny.

In any case, for production servers, I always recommend stable version of
Debian. My advice would be to start with Etch. If you find it inadequate,
you can always upgrade it later.

>
> I know the conventional wisdom is to only install Stable on servers;
> however I am wondering if I can temper that view with the current state
> of Lenny (almost ready for move to stable) and just install it now
> rather than go through a dist-upgrade later.
>

Follow the conventional wisdom. Just go with Etch. From your description of
the problem, I did not see a potential reason to install a testing
distribution on a production machine.

raju
--
Kamaraju S Kusumanchi
http://www.people.cornell.edu/pages/kk288/
http://malayamaarutham.blogspot.com/


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Old 07-15-2008, 01:15 PM
"Stackpole, Chris"
 
Default Using Lenny on production server?

> -----Original Message-----
> From: news [mailto:news@ger.gmane.org] On Behalf Of Kamaraju S
Kusumanchi
> Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 5:26 PM
> To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
> Subject: Re: Using Lenny on production server?
>
> Neil Gunton wrote:
>
> > I run a moderately busy community website, hosted on my own LAMP
(Perl,
> > MySQL) AMD64 server, currently running Etch in a colo. I am going to
go
> > up to the datacenter on July 16th to rebuild the server for various
> > reasons. This will include a complete re-install. One change I am
> > considering is to upgrade to Lenny. I've read that Lenny will
shortly be
> > frozen, for possible release in September 2008, so I'm thinking that
it
> > must be fairly "stable" (not in the formal sense, of course) at this
> > point.
>
> Ask yourself this question. "Why do I need Lenny instead of Etch?" If
the
> answer is "I don't know. Lenny seems to have newer versions." then
stick
> with Etch. New versions does not mean they are good. If the answer
> is "feature X is absent from package Y. This feature is needed to run
the
> website" then you might want Lenny.
>
> In any case, for production servers, I always recommend stable version
of
> Debian. My advice would be to start with Etch. If you find it
inadequate,
> you can always upgrade it later.
>
> >
> > I know the conventional wisdom is to only install Stable on servers;
> > however I am wondering if I can temper that view with the current
state
> > of Lenny (almost ready for move to stable) and just install it now
> > rather than go through a dist-upgrade later.
> >
>
> Follow the conventional wisdom. Just go with Etch. From your
description
> of
> the problem, I did not see a potential reason to install a testing
> distribution on a production machine.
>
> raju
> --
> Kamaraju S Kusumanchi
> http://www.people.cornell.edu/pages/kk288/
> http://malayamaarutham.blogspot.com/
>
>
> --
> To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-REQUEST@lists.debian.org
> with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact
> listmaster@lists.debian.org
>

If you don't have a solid reason for moving to Lenny, then I am going to
second everything that Raju said.

I have a couple of 64bit servers that I run Etch on. However, there is
one that the drivers for Etch gave me many problems and headaches (never
got fully working). Lenny worked straight off. I am now running Debian
Testing on a production server, and I take great care and caution before
I run an update. I only update packages I know I need to update and I
don't run any update to that box till it has been tested before hand on
another.

If you don't have a reason, stay with Etch. If you do have a reason, be
careful! :-)

Have Fun!


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