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Old 06-16-2008, 04:31 PM
Paul Johnson
 
Default Which IM, blog and email service are best for debian users?

On Mon, 2008-06-16 at 16:04 +1000, Rich Healey wrote:
> Ron Johnson wrote:
> > On 06/15/08 05:46, Star Liu wrote:
> >> <snip> except that it refuses root to use it.
> >
> > As well it should. Why are you running as root?
> >
> I disagree. I agree that in 99% of cases running normal UL applications
> as root is a bad idea, but this isn't ubuntu. If I want to play with
> [whatever] as root, then it should damn well let me.

Odds are the decision to fail as root was made by upstream, not Debian.
It would be a good thing if more programs that shouldn't be run as root
(or Administrator) failed as root intentionally, esp. on Windows.

--
Paul Johnson
baloo@ursine.ca
 
Old 06-16-2008, 04:33 PM
Paul Johnson
 
Default Which IM, blog and email service are best for debian users?

On Mon, 2008-06-16 at 10:17 -0500, Ron Johnson wrote:
> On 06/16/08 07:09, Tzafrir Cohen wrote:
> [snip]
> >
> > A certain version of SuSE would set the desktop background to red if you
> > logged in as root.
>
> As did Mandrake, when I left it for Debian. I always thought it was
> a good idea.

Seems like it would be better to just disallow root logins to X. And to
use PGP MIME instead of long-ago deprecated inline PGP.

--
Paul Johnson
baloo@ursine.ca
 
Old 06-16-2008, 04:35 PM
Paul Johnson
 
Default Which IM, blog and email service are best for debian users?

Please demonstrate that you made it through school having learned that
most languages flow in logical order from the top down, not in random
order. The best way to do so is to stop top posting.
http://learn.to/quote

On Mon, 2008-06-16 at 20:35 +0800, Star Liu wrote:

> Thanks for recommending the gaim, i finally found the right IM
> software which support chinese input on etch! I'd like to make a
> report on my thoughts
> 1. my favorite IM softwares: gaim,amsn on etch, pidgin,amsn,emesene on lenny, for I use MSN most

Gaim is gone. It's now called Pidgin.

--
Paul Johnson
baloo@ursine.ca
 
Old 06-16-2008, 04:52 PM
Hal Vaughan
 
Default Which IM, blog and email service are best for debian users?

On Monday 16 June 2008, Paul Johnson wrote:
> On Mon, 2008-06-16 at 10:17 -0500, Ron Johnson wrote:
> > On 06/16/08 07:09, Tzafrir Cohen wrote:
> > [snip]
> >
> > > A certain version of SuSE would set the desktop background to red
> > > if you logged in as root.
> >
> > As did Mandrake, when I left it for Debian. I always thought it
> > was a good idea.
>
> Seems like it would be better to just disallow root logins to X. And
> to use PGP MIME instead of long-ago deprecated inline PGP.

I use root logins to X, but usually while setting up a system. I work
better with a GUI. I know that's not a cool thing to say on a geek
list, but it's the way my brain works. When I set up a system, lots of
times there's mount points to create and other things I need to do that
involved a program like Konqueror.

Also my clients use a program I wrote that needs to be installed as root
for some of the setup scripts, but I needed cross-platform GUI
installer and wasn't going to spend days writing my own, so I settled
on IZPack, which I like so much I've contributed to it. A console
installer was not an option because I needed one installer (try
maintaining 2 installers, one for Windows, one for Linux!) for both
platforms and needed something for people that think the blue "e"
stands for Enternet instead of Internet. The result is needing to use
a GUI installer that has to be run as root. Not my favorite option,
but a necessary one.

On my system, when I'm testing, I can run Xeypher from the command line
so it's not a serious problem and have been willing to walk the few
Linux-using clients of mine through the same process.


Hal


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Old 06-16-2008, 05:43 PM
Ron Johnson
 
Default Which IM, blog and email service are best for debian users?

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On 06/16/08 11:52, Hal Vaughan wrote:
> On Monday 16 June 2008, Paul Johnson wrote:
>> On Mon, 2008-06-16 at 10:17 -0500, Ron Johnson wrote:
>>> On 06/16/08 07:09, Tzafrir Cohen wrote:
>>> [snip]
>>>
>>>> A certain version of SuSE would set the desktop background to red
>>>> if you logged in as root.
>>> As did Mandrake, when I left it for Debian. I always thought it
>>> was a good idea.
>> Seems like it would be better to just disallow root logins to X. And
>> to use PGP MIME instead of long-ago deprecated inline PGP.
>
> I use root logins to X, but usually while setting up a system. I work
> better with a GUI. I know that's not a cool thing to say on a geek
> list, but it's the way my brain works.

Must ... Not ... Make ... Comment ...

> When I set up a system, lots of
> times there's mount points to create and other things I need to do that
> involved a program like Konqueror.
>
> Also my clients use a program I wrote that needs to be installed as root
> for some of the setup scripts, but I needed cross-platform GUI
> installer and wasn't going to spend days writing my own, so I settled
> on IZPack, which I like so much I've contributed to it. A console
> installer was not an option because I needed one installer (try
> maintaining 2 installers, one for Windows, one for Linux!) for both
> platforms and needed something for people that think the blue "e"
> stands for Enternet instead of Internet. The result is needing to use
> a GUI installer that has to be run as root. Not my favorite option,
> but a necessary one.

- From an xterm $ prompt, run "su -p". That will let you run GUI
programs as root while logged in as an unpriv user.

> On my system, when I'm testing, I can run Xeypher from the command line
> so it's not a serious problem and have been willing to walk the few
> Linux-using clients of mine through the same process.

- --
Ron Johnson, Jr.
Jefferson LA USA

"Kittens give Morbo gas. In lighter news, the city of New New
York is doomed."
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Old 06-16-2008, 06:00 PM
Hal Vaughan
 
Default Which IM, blog and email service are best for debian users?

On Monday 16 June 2008, Ron Johnson wrote:
> On 06/16/08 11:52, Hal Vaughan wrote:
> > On Monday 16 June 2008, Paul Johnson wrote:
> >> On Mon, 2008-06-16 at 10:17 -0500, Ron Johnson wrote:
> >>> On 06/16/08 07:09, Tzafrir Cohen wrote:
> >>> [snip]
> >>>
> >>>> A certain version of SuSE would set the desktop background to
> >>>> red if you logged in as root.
> >>>
> >>> As did Mandrake, when I left it for Debian. I always thought it
> >>> was a good idea.
> >>
> >> Seems like it would be better to just disallow root logins to X.
> >> And to use PGP MIME instead of long-ago deprecated inline PGP.
> >
> > I use root logins to X, but usually while setting up a system. I
> > work better with a GUI. I know that's not a cool thing to say on a
> > geek list, but it's the way my brain works.
>
> Must ... Not ... Make ... Comment ...

Go ahead. Please do.

You know darned well I have the background and experience to inundate
you with way too much information on learning styles, how we think, and
that different people work and learn in different ways.

Don't you want me to back up what I said like I've done on other
discussion groups about learning styles and how expecting all people to
use one style of learning, thinking, or working, is inappropriate?

Aren't you just aching to bait me and get a long discussion going so you
can complain about liberals like you so love to do?

Hal


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Old 06-16-2008, 06:16 PM
Paul Johnson
 
Default Which IM, blog and email service are best for debian users?

On Mon, 2008-06-16 at 12:52 -0400, Hal Vaughan wrote:
> On Monday 16 June 2008, Paul Johnson wrote:
> > On Mon, 2008-06-16 at 10:17 -0500, Ron Johnson wrote:
> > > On 06/16/08 07:09, Tzafrir Cohen wrote:
> > > [snip]
> > >
> > > > A certain version of SuSE would set the desktop background to red
> > > > if you logged in as root.
> > >
> > > As did Mandrake, when I left it for Debian. I always thought it
> > > was a good idea.
> >
> > Seems like it would be better to just disallow root logins to X. And
> > to use PGP MIME instead of long-ago deprecated inline PGP.
>
> I use root logins to X, but usually while setting up a system. I work
> better with a GUI. I know that's not a cool thing to say on a geek
> list, but it's the way my brain works. When I set up a system, lots of
> times there's mount points to create and other things I need to do that
> involved a program like Konqueror.

Still seems like a weak excuse: If you log in as a normal user, both
major desktop environments have reasonable "run as another user" methods
that are easy and effective to use as opposed to logging in as root.

--
Paul Johnson
baloo@ursine.ca
 
Old 06-16-2008, 06:16 PM
Ron Johnson
 
Default Which IM, blog and email service are best for debian users?

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On 06/16/08 13:00, Hal Vaughan wrote:
> On Monday 16 June 2008, Ron Johnson wrote:
>> On 06/16/08 11:52, Hal Vaughan wrote:
>>> On Monday 16 June 2008, Paul Johnson wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 2008-06-16 at 10:17 -0500, Ron Johnson wrote:
>>>>> On 06/16/08 07:09, Tzafrir Cohen wrote:
>>>>> [snip]
>>>>>
>>>>>> A certain version of SuSE would set the desktop background to
>>>>>> red if you logged in as root.
>>>>> As did Mandrake, when I left it for Debian. I always thought it
>>>>> was a good idea.
>>>> Seems like it would be better to just disallow root logins to X.
>>>> And to use PGP MIME instead of long-ago deprecated inline PGP.
>>> I use root logins to X, but usually while setting up a system. I
>>> work better with a GUI. I know that's not a cool thing to say on a
>>> geek list, but it's the way my brain works.
>> Must ... Not ... Make ... Comment ...
>
> Go ahead. Please do.
>
> You know darned well I have the background and experience to inundate
> you with way too much information on learning styles, how we think, and
> that different people work and learn in different ways.
>
> Don't you want me to back up what I said like I've done on other
> discussion groups about learning styles and how expecting all people to
> use one style of learning, thinking, or working, is inappropriate?
>
> Aren't you just aching to bait me and get a long discussion going so you
> can complain about liberals like you so love to do?

Complaining about liberals is like complaining about the mosquitos.
Easy to do, but ultimately fruitless.

- --
Ron Johnson, Jr.
Jefferson LA USA

"Kittens give Morbo gas. In lighter news, the city of New New
York is doomed."
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=AV11
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----


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Old 06-16-2008, 06:41 PM
Tzafrir Cohen
 
Default Which IM, blog and email service are best for debian users?

On Mon, Jun 16, 2008 at 09:35:40AM -0700, Paul Johnson wrote:

> On Mon, 2008-06-16 at 20:35 +0800, Star Liu wrote:
>
> > Thanks for recommending the gaim, i finally found the right IM
> > software which support chinese input on etch! I'd like to make a
> > report on my thoughts
> > 1. my favorite IM softwares: gaim,amsn on etch, pidgin,amsn,emesene on lenny, for I use MSN most
>
> Gaim is gone. It's now called Pidgin.

Etch still has Gaim.

--
Tzafrir Cohen | tzafrir@jabber.org | VIM is
http://tzafrir.org.il | | a Mutt's
tzafrir@cohens.org.il | | best
ICQ# 16849754 | | friend


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Old 06-16-2008, 06:51 PM
Paul Johnson
 
Default Which IM, blog and email service are best for debian users?

On Mon, 2008-06-16 at 18:41 +0000, Tzafrir Cohen wrote:
> On Mon, Jun 16, 2008 at 09:35:40AM -0700, Paul Johnson wrote:
>
> > On Mon, 2008-06-16 at 20:35 +0800, Star Liu wrote:
> >
> > > Thanks for recommending the gaim, i finally found the right IM
> > > software which support chinese input on etch! I'd like to make a
> > > report on my thoughts
> > > 1. my favorite IM softwares: gaim,amsn on etch, pidgin,amsn,emesene on lenny, for I use MSN most
> >
> > Gaim is gone. It's now called Pidgin.
>
> Etch still has Gaim.

That may be true, but that wasn't what was under discussion: His
favorite IM clients were. I was pointing out he said the same one
twice.

--
Paul Johnson
baloo@ursine.ca
 

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