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Old 04-04-2011, 12:34 PM
Peter Rapisarda
 
Default The battery cannot be identified.

Wow,
Thank you, thank you, and thank you. *This is def the most helpful reply yet. *I'm still waiting for the new battery to arrive but I'm gonna have to check this stuff out.


On Sat, Apr 2, 2011 at 3:49 PM, Bob Proulx <bob@proulx.com> wrote:

Peter Rapisarda wrote:

> This is something I was afraid of. *I have NO idea what version of debian I

> installed, and I don't know how to find out.



You can tell the version of Debian by looking at the

/etc/debian_version file.



*cat /etc/debian_version



That will say one of the following:



*5.0.8 * * * -- Lenny point release 8 (current oldstable)

*6.0.1 * * * -- Squeeze point release 1 (current stable)

*wheezy/sid *-- Sid Unstable (daily bleeding edge bits)



> While doing the setup I don't recall it saying ANYTHING about a

> laptop and I think this has something to do with my problem.



No. *There isn't anything particularly special about laptops. *The

installer doesn't ask any questions specific to laptops during the

installation. *It isn't needed. *The device drivers in the Linux

kernel will detect if you have a battery and do the right thing.



> I ran the Dell diagnostic utility



You ran this from the BIOS at boot time? *Or you ran it from a

bootable disk?



> and it goes through a few things and then I get a message "No

> diagnostic Utility Partition found. *To run diagnostics insert your

> Dell "Drivers and Utilities" CD, then select OK to restart the

> system and boot off the CD".



You said you replaced the disk. *The factory partition existed on the

factory disk. *Your replacement disk did not have this partition.



> Thankfully I do have the CD and did exactly as the message says, but

> after a minute or two It comes up with a message "Result code:

> 0E00-0002. *Msg: SYSTEM_ERROR. *This system is not recogized as a

> supported Dell PC. *These diagnostics may not run on unsupported

> systems." *I did it a few times just to be sure and I get the same

> result every time and my battery problem has not been fixed.



Grr... *Vendors can be such terrible citizens. *If the disk really

does match the machine then it is probably objecting to the difference

in the size of the disk drive between the old and new. *I have seen

this before myself.



But just the same even if you could run it I doubt it could "fix" your

battery problem. *I think your battery is bad as a hardware problem.

Nothing in software can fix it.



> As I was explaining in another reply I did find a directory called

> /sys/class/power_supply and in there is another directory called AC.



And no directory called something like BAT0? *Then your battery has

fully failed and is not responding.



> Again please excuse me if this sounds dumb but I assume has

> something to do with the AC power outlet on the computer.



Yes.



> Should there be something else in that directory with regards to a

> battery?



Yes.



The /sys is similar to and a newer interface that is also available in

/proc. *On my machine:



*$ find /sys/class/power_supply/BAT0

*/sys/class/power_supply/BAT0

*/sys/class/power_supply/BAT0/uevent

*/sys/class/power_supply/BAT0/subsystem

*/sys/class/power_supply/BAT0/device

*/sys/class/power_supply/BAT0/power

*/sys/class/power_supply/BAT0/power/wakeup

*/sys/class/power_supply/BAT0/type

*/sys/class/power_supply/BAT0/status

*/sys/class/power_supply/BAT0/present

*/sys/class/power_supply/BAT0/technology

*/sys/class/power_supply/BAT0/voltage_min_design

*/sys/class/power_supply/BAT0/voltage_now

*/sys/class/power_supply/BAT0/current_now

*/sys/class/power_supply/BAT0/energy_full_design

*/sys/class/power_supply/BAT0/energy_full

*/sys/class/power_supply/BAT0/energy_now

*/sys/class/power_supply/BAT0/model_name

*/sys/class/power_supply/BAT0/manufacturer

*/sys/class/power_supply/BAT0/serial_number

*/sys/class/power_supply/BAT0/alarm



> Does this have something to do with installing the "laptop version"

> of debian?



No. *But it has everything to do with having a failed battery.



Bob
 
Old 04-06-2011, 07:11 PM
Peter Rapisarda
 
Default The battery cannot be identified.

I already ordered a new battery, but out of curiosity I executed those commands you told me to (find /proc/acpi/battery, cat /proc/acpi/battery/BAT0/state, cat /proc/acpi/battery/BAT0/info) and this is what I found:

cat /proc/acpi/battery/BAT0/info

present: * * * * * * * * yes
design capacity: * * * * 4400 mAh
last full capacity: * * *3334 mAh

battery technology: * * *rechargeable
design voltage: * * * * *14800 mV
design capacity warning: 440 mAh
design capacity low: * * 133 mAh

capacity granularity 1: *44 mAh
capacity granularity 2: *44 mAh
model number: * * * * * *DELL53LSN
serial number: * * * * * 678

battery type: * * * * * *LION
OEM info: * * * * * * * *Sanyo
cat /proc/acpi/battery/BAT0/statepresent: * * * * * * * * yes

capacity state: * * * * *ok
charging state: * * * * *charged
present rate: * * * * * *1 mA
remaining capacity: * * *4400 mAh

present voltage: * * * * 16748 mV

Does this mean anything to you? *And just to be clear this is the old, presumably non-functioning, battery.

Thanks,-Pete

On Sat, Apr 2, 2011 at 3:37 PM, Bob Proulx <bob@proulx.com> wrote:

Peter Rapisarda wrote:

> to complement my studying I decided to resurrect an old laptop which is a

> Dell Inspiron 2200 with a Intel Celeron M processor. *The hard drive had

> gone bad so I replaced it



Should be fine. *My main laptop is of similar vintage. *I have

replaced the battery however.



> and purched a verison of debian off of OSDisc.com and used that to

> install debian on my "new" system. *Everything works great except

> when I start up the computer i get a message that says:

>

> Time-of-day not set - please run SETUP program

> WARNING: The battery cannot be identified.

> This system will be unable to charge this battery...



That message would not come from Debian. *I believe (not 100% so

beware) that that type of message would come from the BIOS at boot

time when it runs its POST (power on self check). *It wouldn't have

started to load the OS yet.



Old machines sometimes have problems with the hardware clock because

the backup battery on the clock will have died over the years. *This

can often be fixed easily by replacing the battery which is usually a

very common CR2032 battery. *For a desktop with an always available

internet connection this is usually a don't-care because the OS can

set the clock at boot time from an internet time source. *For a laptop

this is somewhat more important because if you boot away from any

network connection then it will probably think the time is 1970 at the

zero integer time of the Unix epoch since the clock usually returns 0.

Depending upon how you use your laptop this may or may not annoy you

or others. *You can probably ignore it if you understand it.



Old laptops sometimes have problems with failed batteries, both main

batteries and clock batteries. *Different manufacturers do different

things with the main battery information. *Some will report 100% even

if the battery can't hold a charge. *It isn't unusual to need to

replace the battery on old laptops.



> Is this a problem with the battery itself, or did I install something

> incorrectly maybe? *If I leave the laptop plugged in it works like a charm,

> but the second I take the plug out of the wall (even with the battery

> inserted into the laptop) it shuts off. *As you can imagine this is

> extremely annooying and I have no idea what to do. *I don't want to go out

> and purchase a new battery until I'm sure that's the issue. *Any help would

> be greatly appreciated.



I think your problem is mostly likely a worn out battery that is no

longer servicable. *To know for sure you will need to look at the data

for the battery.



Run this command and see what information is available:



*find /proc/acpi/battery



Then print the contents of any "state" or "info" files that are shown

there. *On my machine I have BAT0 and the following files. *The names

of the directories may vary somewhat depending upon what BIOS and ACPI

subsystem exists on your machine. *Vendors will show different units.

Pretty much every vendor will have somewhat unique data here. *You

need to look at it and then deal with the result.



*$ cat /proc/acpi/battery/BAT0/state

*present: * * * * * * * * yes

*capacity state: * * * * *ok

*charging state: * * * * *charged

*present rate: * * * * * *0 mW

*remaining capacity: * * *70010 mWh

*present voltage: * * * * 12393 mV



*$ cat /proc/acpi/battery/BAT0/info

*present: * * * * * * * * yes

*design capacity: * * * * 77760 mWh

*last full capacity: * * *70090 mWh

*battery technology: * * *rechargeable

*design voltage: * * * * *10800 mV

*design capacity warning: 3504 mWh

*design capacity low: * * 200 mWh

*capacity granularity 1: *1 mWh

*capacity granularity 2: *1 mWh

*model number: * * * * * *IBM-08K8193

*serial number: * * * * * * 107

*battery type: * * * * * *LION

*OEM info: * * * * * * * *FLT



This tells us that my battery is designed for 77 watt-hours but is

currently only holding 70 watt-hours. *It is plugged into power at the

moment so so the discharge rate is zero. *This shows a degradation

from new condition to 90% of design. *It is a relatively new battery

and so this looks pretty good. *But an old and worn out battery may

only show a last full capacity of 10 watt-hours or worse!



If you post your information about your battery then folks on this

list can help diagnose it.



Bob
 
Old 04-06-2011, 07:43 PM
Bob Proulx
 
Default The battery cannot be identified.

Peter Rapisarda wrote:
> cat /proc/acpi/battery/BAT0/info
> present: yes

This information is in conflict with the previous information that you
posted saying that you didn't have any battery directories but just AC
directories. Perhaps between then and now your battery became
connected? Because at boot time if the battery is detected then it
should provide this directory of information. If it isn't then it
doesn't. It is fully dynamic with every boot. The /proc isn't really
a filesystem but an interface to the kernel. It is a memory only
filesystem presenting an interface of information and controls.

> design capacity: 4400 mAh

The battery says it has a vendor new rating of 4.4 amp-hours. (It can
supply one amp of current for 4.4 hours. Or two amps of current for
2.2 hours. A typical machine pulls between 1-2 amps during running
and that would normally provide between 2-4 hours of runtime.)

> last full capacity: 3334 mAh

The battery says that when last charged it was able to hold 3.3 amp
hours of charge. That is a degradation of 75% from new. That isn't
terribly terrible. My own main battery is sitting at around 90% at
the moment. (I have a big extended capacity 9 cell 7.7 AH battery.
The standard 6-cell for my machine has around 4.6 AH standard
capacity.) Batteries age over time as they are used. If it were
really very bad then I would expect it to say something down in the
one amp-hour range.

The rest of the information is vaguely interesting data about the
battery and was pretty much as expected. But there was something that
seemed a little odd to me.

> battery technology: rechargeable
> design voltage: 14800 mV
> design capacity warning: 440 mAh
> design capacity low: 133 mAh
> capacity granularity 1: 44 mAh
> capacity granularity 2: 44 mAh
> model number: DELL53LSN
> serial number: 678
> battery type: LION
> OEM info: Sanyo
>
> cat /proc/acpi/battery/BAT0/state
> present: yes
> capacity state: ok
> charging state: charged
> present rate: 1 mA
> remaining capacity: 4400 mAh
> present voltage: 16748 mV

Here it is showing that while the battery is charged that it is still
charging the battery at a rate of 1 milli-amp. If it is charged then
I would expect the rate to be zero. Otherwise it will continue to
charge (although at a very slow rate) which will eventually "cook" the
battery. Excess charge can't be stored after the battery is fully
chemically converted and the excess energy will be converted to heat
energy. This is a topic that everyone has an opinion upon and my
opinion is that this often results in out-gassing of battery chemicals
resulting in reduced battery capacity.

> Does this mean anything to you? And just to be clear this is the old,
> presumably non-functioning, battery.

That data doesn't look like a non-functioning battery. It looks like
it has 3.3 AH of capacity. If you removed the AC power it should
provide power to your laptop for at least some while. If you could
see the rate that it was discharging at that time then you would be
able to calculate an approximate runtime for that battery. However I
have found that in practice the firmware calculating these values may
be wildly optimistic and the values may change wildly during
operation. In other words... You have to try it and see how well it
actually performs and even though it says 3.3 AH it may result in
something much different after a few battery cycles.

But if you remove AC power and the machine drops out immediately
without any sign of battery being used then something bad is
happening. Perhaps the firmware is lying to you. It wouldn't be the
first time. Or something else must be wrong. At that point I don't
know.

Bob
 
Old 04-06-2011, 07:52 PM
Bob Proulx
 
Default The battery cannot be identified.

Bob Proulx wrote:
> > design capacity: 4400 mAh
> > last full capacity: 3334 mAh
> > remaining capacity: 4400 mAh

Oh! I just saw something else too. This is definitely conflicting
information from the battery. The last full capacity is 3.3 AH but it
has 4.4 AH remaining? But remaining capacity can't exceed the last
full capacity and therefore that can't be correct. Usually remaining
capacity is your current charge level which goes down as you use it
and up as you charge it. The high-water-mark of the maximum charge
sets the last full capacity value.

A little side discussion: A lot of vendors use remaining capacity
divided by last full capacity to calculate the percentage of battery
for display. So even if the battery was worn out at 1 AH if it
charged to that amount then it would say charged 100%. That keeps
their support calls minimized. Otherwise if they calculated it using
remaining capacity divided by design capacity they would start out
showing values such as 115% (which doesn't make sense either) and
would over the next two years of use never charge above 75% and their
customers would be unhappy. As a technical type I like to know both
values but for the typical consumer neither one is suitable for them.

Bob
 
Old 04-07-2011, 01:53 PM
Peter Rapisarda
 
Default The battery cannot be identified.

Interesting.* Well when I pull the plug it does drop out immediatley.* So I'm not sure what to make of all this really.* I'll post what happens with the new battery when I get it.
*
Thanks again,
-Pete


On Wed, Apr 6, 2011 at 3:43 PM, Bob Proulx <bob@proulx.com> wrote:


Peter Rapisarda wrote:
> cat /proc/acpi/battery/BAT0/info
> present: * * * * * * * * yes

This information is in conflict with the previous information that you
posted saying that you didn't have any battery directories but just AC

directories. *Perhaps between then and now your battery became
connected? *Because at boot time if the battery is detected then it
should provide this directory of information. *If it isn't then it
doesn't. *It is fully dynamic with every boot. *The /proc isn't really

a filesystem but an interface to the kernel. *It is a memory only
filesystem presenting an interface of information and controls.

> design capacity: * * * * 4400 mAh

The battery says it has a vendor new rating of 4.4 amp-hours. *(It can

supply one amp of current for 4.4 hours. *Or two amps of current for
2.2 hours. *A typical machine pulls between 1-2 amps during running
and that would normally provide between 2-4 hours of runtime.)


> last full capacity: * * *3334 mAh

The battery says that when last charged it was able to hold 3.3 amp
hours of charge. *That is a degradation of 75% from new. *That isn't
terribly terrible. *My own main battery is sitting at around 90% at

the moment. *(I have a big extended capacity 9 cell 7.7 AH battery.
The standard 6-cell for my machine has around 4.6 AH standard
capacity.) *Batteries age over time as they are used. *If it were
really very bad then I would expect it to say something down in the

one amp-hour range.

The rest of the information is vaguely interesting data about the
battery and was pretty much as expected. *But there was something that
seemed a little odd to me.


> battery technology: * * *rechargeable
> design voltage: * * * * *14800 mV
> design capacity warning: 440 mAh
> design capacity low: * * 133 mAh
> capacity granularity 1: *44 mAh

> capacity granularity 2: *44 mAh
> model number: * * * * * *DELL53LSN
> serial number: * * * * * 678
> battery type: * * * * * *LION
> OEM info: * * * * * * * *Sanyo
>
> cat /proc/acpi/battery/BAT0/state

> present: * * * * * * * * yes
> capacity state: * * * * *ok
> charging state: * * * * *charged
> present rate: * * * * * *1 mA
> remaining capacity: * * *4400 mAh
> present voltage: * * * * 16748 mV


Here it is showing that while the battery is charged that it is still
charging the battery at a rate of 1 milli-amp. *If it is charged then
I would expect the rate to be zero. *Otherwise it will continue to

charge (although at a very slow rate) which will eventually "cook" the
battery. *Excess charge can't be stored after the battery is fully
chemically converted and the excess energy will be converted to heat

energy. *This is a topic that everyone has an opinion upon and my
opinion is that this often results in out-gassing of battery chemicals
resulting in reduced battery capacity.


> Does this mean anything to you? *And just to be clear this is the old,
> presumably non-functioning, battery.

That data doesn't look like a non-functioning battery. *It looks like

it has 3.3 AH of capacity. *If you removed the AC power it should
provide power to your laptop for at least some while. *If you could
see the rate that it was discharging at that time then you would be
able to calculate an approximate runtime for that battery. *However I

have found that in practice the firmware calculating these values may
be wildly optimistic and the values may change wildly during
operation. *In other words... *You have to try it and see how well it
actually performs and even though it says 3.3 AH it may result in

something much different after a few battery cycles.

But if you remove AC power and the machine drops out immediately
without any sign of battery being used then something bad is
happening. *Perhaps the firmware is lying to you. *It wouldn't be the

first time. *Or something else must be wrong. *At that point I don't
know.

Bob
 
Old 04-07-2011, 03:29 PM
Peter Rapisarda
 
Default The battery cannot be identified.

One more thing. *I checked in my /sys directory again for the power_supply just to see what happens. *When I checked the first time I must not have had the battery inserted because now I have AC and BAT0 in power_supply directory.

I ran ls -last on the BAT0 directory in the sys directory and this is what came up:
total 00*-rw-r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 06:06 alarm0*
drwxr-xr-x 2 root root * *0 2011-03-10 06:04 power0*-r--r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 charge_full0*-r--r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 charge_now0*
-r--r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 current_now0*-r--r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 status0*-r--r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 charge_full_design
0*-r--r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 manufacturer0*-r--r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 model_name0*-r--r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 present
0*-r--r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 serial_number0*-r--r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 voltage_min_design0*-r--r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 voltage_now
0*lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root * *0 2011-03-10 05:23 device -> ../../../devices/LNXSYSTM:00/device:00/PNP0C0A:000*lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root * *0 2011-03-10 05:23 subsystem -> ../../power_supply
0*-r--r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 technology0*-rw-r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 uevent0*-r--r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 type
0*drwxr-xr-x 3 root root * *0 2011-03-10 05:22 .0*drwxr-xr-x 4 root root * *0 2011-03-10 05:22 ..
I don't know if any of this is helpful but I just thought I'd share. *Just to be sure I made*certain*the battery was inserted and removed the AC power and it still shuts off.


On Wed, Apr 6, 2011 at 3:43 PM, Bob Proulx <bob@proulx.com> wrote:

Peter Rapisarda wrote:

> cat /proc/acpi/battery/BAT0/info

> present: * * * * * * * * yes



This information is in conflict with the previous information that you

posted saying that you didn't have any battery directories but just AC

directories. *Perhaps between then and now your battery became

connected? *Because at boot time if the battery is detected then it

should provide this directory of information. *If it isn't then it

doesn't. *It is fully dynamic with every boot. *The /proc isn't really

a filesystem but an interface to the kernel. *It is a memory only

filesystem presenting an interface of information and controls.



> design capacity: * * * * 4400 mAh



The battery says it has a vendor new rating of 4.4 amp-hours. *(It can

supply one amp of current for 4.4 hours. *Or two amps of current for

2.2 hours. *A typical machine pulls between 1-2 amps during running

and that would normally provide between 2-4 hours of runtime.)



> last full capacity: * * *3334 mAh



The battery says that when last charged it was able to hold 3.3 amp

hours of charge. *That is a degradation of 75% from new. *That isn't

terribly terrible. *My own main battery is sitting at around 90% at

the moment. *(I have a big extended capacity 9 cell 7.7 AH battery.

The standard 6-cell for my machine has around 4.6 AH standard

capacity.) *Batteries age over time as they are used. *If it were

really very bad then I would expect it to say something down in the

one amp-hour range.



The rest of the information is vaguely interesting data about the

battery and was pretty much as expected. *But there was something that

seemed a little odd to me.



> battery technology: * * *rechargeable

> design voltage: * * * * *14800 mV

> design capacity warning: 440 mAh

> design capacity low: * * 133 mAh

> capacity granularity 1: *44 mAh

> capacity granularity 2: *44 mAh

> model number: * * * * * *DELL53LSN

> serial number: * * * * * 678

> battery type: * * * * * *LION

> OEM info: * * * * * * * *Sanyo

>

> cat /proc/acpi/battery/BAT0/state

> present: * * * * * * * * yes

> capacity state: * * * * *ok

> charging state: * * * * *charged

> present rate: * * * * * *1 mA

> remaining capacity: * * *4400 mAh

> present voltage: * * * * 16748 mV



Here it is showing that while the battery is charged that it is still

charging the battery at a rate of 1 milli-amp. *If it is charged then

I would expect the rate to be zero. *Otherwise it will continue to

charge (although at a very slow rate) which will eventually "cook" the

battery. *Excess charge can't be stored after the battery is fully

chemically converted and the excess energy will be converted to heat

energy. *This is a topic that everyone has an opinion upon and my

opinion is that this often results in out-gassing of battery chemicals

resulting in reduced battery capacity.



> Does this mean anything to you? *And just to be clear this is the old,

> presumably non-functioning, battery.



That data doesn't look like a non-functioning battery. *It looks like

it has 3.3 AH of capacity. *If you removed the AC power it should

provide power to your laptop for at least some while. *If you could

see the rate that it was discharging at that time then you would be

able to calculate an approximate runtime for that battery. *However I

have found that in practice the firmware calculating these values may

be wildly optimistic and the values may change wildly during

operation. *In other words... *You have to try it and see how well it

actually performs and even though it says 3.3 AH it may result in

something much different after a few battery cycles.



But if you remove AC power and the machine drops out immediately

without any sign of battery being used then something bad is

happening. *Perhaps the firmware is lying to you. *It wouldn't be the

first time. *Or something else must be wrong. *At that point I don't

know.



Bob
 
Old 04-07-2011, 03:40 PM
Peter Rapisarda
 
Default The battery cannot be identified.

Just put in the new battery and it started up right away with no AC power needed. *I guess it was faulty hardware.
Thank you all so much (especially you Bob),-Pete

On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 11:29 AM, Peter Rapisarda <peter.rapisarda@gmail.com> wrote:

One more thing. *I checked in my /sys directory again for the power_supply just to see what happens. *When I checked the first time I must not have had the battery inserted because now I have AC and BAT0 in power_supply directory.


I ran ls -last on the BAT0 directory in the sys directory and this is what came up:
total 00*-rw-r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 06:06 alarm0*

drwxr-xr-x 2 root root * *0 2011-03-10 06:04 power0*-r--r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 charge_full0*-r--r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 charge_now
0*
-r--r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 current_now0*-r--r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 status0*-r--r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 charge_full_design

0*-r--r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 manufacturer0*-r--r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 model_name0*-r--r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 present

0*-r--r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 serial_number0*-r--r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 voltage_min_design0*-r--r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 voltage_now

0*lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root * *0 2011-03-10 05:23 device -> ../../../devices/LNXSYSTM:00/device:00/PNP0C0A:000*lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root * *0 2011-03-10 05:23 subsystem -> ../../power_supply

0*-r--r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 technology0*-rw-r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 uevent0*-r--r--r-- 1 root root 4096 2011-03-10 05:23 type

0*drwxr-xr-x 3 root root * *0 2011-03-10 05:22 .0*drwxr-xr-x 4 root root * *0 2011-03-10 05:22 ..
I don't know if any of this is helpful but I just thought I'd share. *Just to be sure I made*certain*the battery was inserted and removed the AC power and it still shuts off.



On Wed, Apr 6, 2011 at 3:43 PM, Bob Proulx <bob@proulx.com> wrote:


Peter Rapisarda wrote:

> cat /proc/acpi/battery/BAT0/info

> present: * * * * * * * * yes



This information is in conflict with the previous information that you

posted saying that you didn't have any battery directories but just AC

directories. *Perhaps between then and now your battery became

connected? *Because at boot time if the battery is detected then it

should provide this directory of information. *If it isn't then it

doesn't. *It is fully dynamic with every boot. *The /proc isn't really

a filesystem but an interface to the kernel. *It is a memory only

filesystem presenting an interface of information and controls.



> design capacity: * * * * 4400 mAh



The battery says it has a vendor new rating of 4.4 amp-hours. *(It can

supply one amp of current for 4.4 hours. *Or two amps of current for

2.2 hours. *A typical machine pulls between 1-2 amps during running

and that would normally provide between 2-4 hours of runtime.)



> last full capacity: * * *3334 mAh



The battery says that when last charged it was able to hold 3.3 amp

hours of charge. *That is a degradation of 75% from new. *That isn't

terribly terrible. *My own main battery is sitting at around 90% at

the moment. *(I have a big extended capacity 9 cell 7.7 AH battery.

The standard 6-cell for my machine has around 4.6 AH standard

capacity.) *Batteries age over time as they are used. *If it were

really very bad then I would expect it to say something down in the

one amp-hour range.



The rest of the information is vaguely interesting data about the

battery and was pretty much as expected. *But there was something that

seemed a little odd to me.



> battery technology: * * *rechargeable

> design voltage: * * * * *14800 mV

> design capacity warning: 440 mAh

> design capacity low: * * 133 mAh

> capacity granularity 1: *44 mAh

> capacity granularity 2: *44 mAh

> model number: * * * * * *DELL53LSN

> serial number: * * * * * 678

> battery type: * * * * * *LION

> OEM info: * * * * * * * *Sanyo

>

> cat /proc/acpi/battery/BAT0/state

> present: * * * * * * * * yes

> capacity state: * * * * *ok

> charging state: * * * * *charged

> present rate: * * * * * *1 mA

> remaining capacity: * * *4400 mAh

> present voltage: * * * * 16748 mV



Here it is showing that while the battery is charged that it is still

charging the battery at a rate of 1 milli-amp. *If it is charged then

I would expect the rate to be zero. *Otherwise it will continue to

charge (although at a very slow rate) which will eventually "cook" the

battery. *Excess charge can't be stored after the battery is fully

chemically converted and the excess energy will be converted to heat

energy. *This is a topic that everyone has an opinion upon and my

opinion is that this often results in out-gassing of battery chemicals

resulting in reduced battery capacity.



> Does this mean anything to you? *And just to be clear this is the old,

> presumably non-functioning, battery.



That data doesn't look like a non-functioning battery. *It looks like

it has 3.3 AH of capacity. *If you removed the AC power it should

provide power to your laptop for at least some while. *If you could

see the rate that it was discharging at that time then you would be

able to calculate an approximate runtime for that battery. *However I

have found that in practice the firmware calculating these values may

be wildly optimistic and the values may change wildly during

operation. *In other words... *You have to try it and see how well it

actually performs and even though it says 3.3 AH it may result in

something much different after a few battery cycles.



But if you remove AC power and the machine drops out immediately

without any sign of battery being used then something bad is

happening. *Perhaps the firmware is lying to you. *It wouldn't be the

first time. *Or something else must be wrong. *At that point I don't

know.



Bob
 
Old 07-04-2011, 12:06 PM
Ognjen Bezanov
 
Default The battery cannot be identified.

Sounds like the both the BIOS backup and main battery has died. Every
time the laptop is unplugged the bios will reset, including the time.

In these situations, when it next boots up it will prompt you to update
the clock. That is what it means when it says "please run SETUP program".

Once set up and booting, it should not pester you to do this unless you
unplug the PC again. I have a few laptops kicking around that do this,
but as I keep them always plugged in (as servers) it doesn't bother me.
(In fact I have an old PIII Inspiron 8000 with this issue, running as
download box)

If you want to, you could always replace the battery with a new one.
Really depends on whether it's worth it for you. Which battery you
replace is dependent on whether you want to use it as a laptop, or not.

O.


On 04/01/11 16:38, Peter Rapisarda wrote:
> Hello all,
>
> I am a student who is just learning LINUX for the first time so I
> basically have NO idea what I'm doing so please be patient with me. In
> an attempted to complement my studying I decided to resurrect an old
> laptop which is a Dell Inspiron 2200 with a Intel Celeron M processor.
> The hard drive had gone bad so I replaced it and purched a verison of
> debian off of OSDisc.com and used that to install debian on my "new"
> system. Everything works great except when I start up the computer i
> get a message that says:
>
> Time-of-day not set - please run SETUP program
> WARNING: The battery cannot be identified.
> This system will be unable to charge this battery...
>
> Is this a problem with the battery itself, or did I install something
> incorrectly maybe? If I leave the laptop plugged in it works like a
> charm, but the second I take the plug out of the wall (even with the
> battery inserted into the laptop) it shuts off. As you can imagine this
> is extremely annooying and I have no idea what to do. I don't want to
> go out and purchase a new battery until I'm sure that's the issue. Any
> help would be greatly appreciated.
>
> Thanks,
> -Pete



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