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Old 08-31-2008, 04:49 AM
"Matthew W. S. Bell"
 
Default Bug#497230: legacy and generic package descriptions

Package: linux-2.6
Version: 2.6.26-4
Severity: normal

Please would you update the description of the legacy and generic (and
possibly smp) packages such that the user would be able to work out what
type of machines are intended to be legacy and generic (and possibly
smp); it is somewhat hard to work out what package to use otherwise.
Further, this information does not appear to be documented anywhere else.


Thanks,
Matthew W. S. Bell




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Old 09-01-2008, 01:56 PM
maximilian attems
 
Default Bug#497230: legacy and generic package descriptions

[ adding d-alpha on cc ]

On Sun, 31 Aug 2008, Matthew W. S. Bell wrote:

> Package: linux-2.6
> Version: 2.6.26-4
> Severity: normal
>
> Please would you update the description of the legacy and generic (and
> possibly smp) packages such that the user would be able to work out what
> type of machines are intended to be legacy and generic (and possibly
> smp); it is somewhat hard to work out what package to use otherwise.
> Further, this information does not appear to be documented anywhere else.

what do you suggest?



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Old 09-01-2008, 11:32 PM
"Matthew W. S. Bell"
 
Default Bug#497230: legacy and generic package descriptions

maximilian attems wrote:

what do you suggest?

Well, I still don't entirely know what the -legacy package is for nor
what constitutes an "Alpha Legacy Machine". Looking at the linux-2.6
Debian changelog it appears it may be something to do with MILO.


Matthew




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Old 09-10-2008, 08:41 AM
Fabian Greffrath
 
Default Bug#497230: legacy and generic package descriptions

Well, I still don't entirely know what the -legacy package is for nor
what constitutes an "Alpha Legacy Machine". Looking at the linux-2.6
Debian changelog it appears it may be something to do with MILO.


Yes, same problem here.

Please provide a (non-exhaustive) list of model and/or system types
that are supported by each particular package. For example, I have an
"Alpha EV67" with system type and variation reported as "Tsunami" and
"Monet" by /proc/cpuinfo. However, I still don't have any clue if I
have to install the -generic or the -legacy kernel.


Thanks!

Cheers,
Fabian
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Ruhr-Universität Bochum
Lehrstuhl für Energieanlagen und Energieprozesstechnik (LEAT)
Universitätsstr. 150, IB 3/134
D-44780 Bochum

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Old 11-17-2008, 02:54 AM
"Matthew W. S. Bell"
 
Default Bug#497230: legacy and generic package descriptions

On Tue, 2008-09-02 at 00:32 +0100, Matthew W. S. Bell wrote:
> Well, I still don't entirely know what the -legacy package is for nor
> what constitutes an "Alpha Legacy Machine". Looking at the linux-2.6
> Debian changelog it appears it may be something to do with MILO.

Further investigation eventually reveals that the only change in the
kernels is the CONFIG_ALPHA_LEGACY_START_ADDRESS. This option has the
following help:
-
The 2.4 kernel changed the kernel start address from 0x310000 to
0x810000 to make room for the Wildfire's larger SRM console. Recent
consoles on Titan and Marvel machines also require the extra room.

If you're using aboot 0.7 or later, the bootloader will examine the ELF
headers to determine where to transfer control. Unfortunately, most
older bootloaders -- APB or MILO -- hardcoded the kernel start address
rather than examining the ELF headers, and the result is a hard lockup.

Say Y if you have a broken bootloader. Say N if you do not, or if `you
wish to run on Wildfire, Titan, or Marvel.
-

Hopefully this should be informative enough for the creation of some
explanatory prose for -legacy and -generic.

Matthew




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Old 11-17-2008, 04:39 AM
Brian Szymanski
 
Default Bug#497230: legacy and generic package descriptions

That's, what, 5MB of space? It seems to me we have it backwards --
legacy should be the default, and folks on newer hardware can apt-get
install the "non-legacy" kernel if they want to free up 5mb of physical
memory. Or am I missing something?



Matthew W. S. Bell wrote:

On Tue, 2008-09-02 at 00:32 +0100, Matthew W. S. Bell wrote:


Well, I still don't entirely know what the -legacy package is for nor
what constitutes an "Alpha Legacy Machine". Looking at the linux-2.6
Debian changelog it appears it may be something to do with MILO.



Further investigation eventually reveals that the only change in the
kernels is the CONFIG_ALPHA_LEGACY_START_ADDRESS. This option has the
following help:
-
The 2.4 kernel changed the kernel start address from 0x310000 to
0x810000 to make room for the Wildfire's larger SRM console. Recent
consoles on Titan and Marvel machines also require the extra room.

If you're using aboot 0.7 or later, the bootloader will examine the ELF
headers to determine where to transfer control. Unfortunately, most
older bootloaders -- APB or MILO -- hardcoded the kernel start address
rather than examining the ELF headers, and the result is a hard lockup.

Say Y if you have a broken bootloader. Say N if you do not, or if `you
wish to run on Wildfire, Titan, or Marvel.
-

Hopefully this should be informative enough for the creation of some
explanatory prose for -legacy and -generic.

Matthew








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Old 11-17-2008, 05:58 AM
Steve Langasek
 
Default Bug#497230: legacy and generic package descriptions

On Mon, Nov 17, 2008 at 12:39:50AM -0500, Brian Szymanski wrote:
> That's, what, 5MB of space? It seems to me we have it backwards --
> legacy should be the default, and folks on newer hardware can apt-get
> install the "non-legacy" kernel if they want to free up 5mb of physical
> memory. Or am I missing something?

Yes, you are. A kernel loaded at the legacy address *won't boot* on the
newer hardware.

--
Steve Langasek Give me a lever long enough and a Free OS
Debian Developer to set it on, and I can move the world.
Ubuntu Developer http://www.debian.org/
slangasek@ubuntu.com vorlon@debian.org


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Old 11-17-2008, 10:57 AM
Paul Slootman
 
Default Bug#497230: legacy and generic package descriptions

On Mon 17 Nov 2008, Matthew W. S. Bell wrote:

> Further investigation eventually reveals that the only change in the
> kernels is the CONFIG_ALPHA_LEGACY_START_ADDRESS. This option has the
> following help:
> -
> The 2.4 kernel changed the kernel start address from 0x310000 to
> 0x810000 to make room for the Wildfire's larger SRM console. Recent
> consoles on Titan and Marvel machines also require the extra room.
>
> If you're using aboot 0.7 or later, the bootloader will examine the ELF
> headers to determine where to transfer control. Unfortunately, most
> older bootloaders -- APB or MILO -- hardcoded the kernel start address
> rather than examining the ELF headers, and the result is a hard lockup.

Hmm, I have no problem booting a 2.6 kernel on my XLT which uses MILO.
It even booted 2.6.27, but immediately after that paniced with at the
end an "Aaiiieee, not not syncing"; the cause was scrolled off the
screen then :-(
So back to my 2.6.17.11 kernel for the time being (recompiling a kernel
is a non-trivial task on my alpha, taking about 2 hours...)


Paul



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Old 11-17-2008, 10:59 AM
Paul Slootman
 
Default Bug#497230: legacy and generic package descriptions

On Mon 17 Nov 2008, Paul Slootman wrote:
>
> Hmm, I have no problem booting a 2.6 kernel on my XLT which uses MILO.

OK, after re-reading the thread, I have to admit that I have LEGACY_START set :-)


Paul



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Old 11-17-2008, 05:04 PM
"Matthew W. S. Bell"
 
Default Bug#497230: legacy and generic package descriptions

On Mon, 2008-11-17 at 00:39 -0500, Brian Szymanski wrote:
> That's, what, 5MB of space? It seems to me we have it backwards --
> legacy should be the default, and folks on newer hardware can apt-get
> install the "non-legacy" kernel if they want to free up 5mb of
> physical memory. Or am I missing something?

I think it's more of an issue of address space collisions than memory
usage.

Matthew




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