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Old 07-29-2008, 09:16 AM
Paul van der Vlis
 
Default Xen advice requested

Hello,

For a few months I build a new Xen server, both domU en dom0 are
64-bits. I had some hardware problems, that's the reason the server is
not doing production-work now, but I would like to go in production real
soon.

My problem is that I made this server for a longer term. And I don't see
a 64-bit domU in the 2.6.25 kernel, only a 32-bit domU kernel with PAE
support.

My processor supports hardware virtualisation and I would like to use 8
GB RAM total. No domU is using more then 2 GB RAM.

Do you think it is better to switch to a 32-bit domU?
And what to do with the dom0 then? There is no Debian-kernel with a
32-bits PAE domU, so far I know. Not in Etch and not in Lenny.
Is KVM a better option for a dom0 maybe?

I am running Etch now, I would like to run Lenny soon as possible, but
Etch is OK for the coming year if necessary. I don't like building my
own kernel or using software what's not in Debian.

With regards,
Paul van der Vlis.




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Old 07-30-2008, 09:08 AM
Pasi Kärkkäinen
 
Default Xen advice requested

On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 11:16:23AM +0200, Paul van der Vlis wrote:
> Hello,
>
> For a few months I build a new Xen server, both domU en dom0 are
> 64-bits. I had some hardware problems, that's the reason the server is
> not doing production-work now, but I would like to go in production real
> soon.
>
> My problem is that I made this server for a longer term. And I don't see
> a 64-bit domU in the 2.6.25 kernel, only a 32-bit domU kernel with PAE
> support.
>

Linux 2.6.25 contains 32b xen domU support implemented on top of Linux pv_ops
framework.

pv_ops xen domU support in 2.6.25 doesn't include 64 bit support.. it is
queued for 2.6.27.

> My processor supports hardware virtualisation and I would like to use 8
> GB RAM total. No domU is using more then 2 GB RAM.
>

So you need PAE or full 64b.

> Do you think it is better to switch to a 32-bit domU?
> And what to do with the dom0 then? There is no Debian-kernel with a
> 32-bits PAE domU, so far I know. Not in Etch and not in Lenny.
> Is KVM a better option for a dom0 maybe?
>

All 32b xen kernels should be PAE now, because non-PAE xen kernels are not
supported/developed anymore.

Linux 2.6.26 pv_ops xen domU support is PAE-only.

http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenParavirtOps

> I am running Etch now, I would like to run Lenny soon as possible, but
> Etch is OK for the coming year if necessary. I don't like building my
> own kernel or using software what's not in Debian.
>

pv_ops Linux 2.6.2(5|6|7) doesn't contain xen dom0 support..

So the best option is to run etch in dom0, and lenny in domU.

-- Pasi


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Old 07-30-2008, 10:51 AM
Teodor
 
Default Xen advice requested

On Wed, Jul 30, 2008 at 12:08 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen <pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
> pv_ops Linux 2.6.2(5|6|7) doesn't contain xen dom0 support..
>
> So the best option is to run etch in dom0, and lenny in domU.

In addition to what was already said, lenny domU is only 32-bit.
I'm running just fine lenny on dom0, but ONLY with the xen kernel from
etch. The libc, the xen tools and all other packages (except the
linux-image-2.6.18-6-xen-*) are from lenny. The xen tools from etch
are incompatible with the packages from lenny (e.g. the hypervisor).

Thanks
 
Old 07-31-2008, 06:28 AM
Paul van der Vlis
 
Default Xen advice requested

Pasi Kärkkäinen schreef:
> On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 11:16:23AM +0200, Paul van der Vlis wrote:
>> Hello,
>>
>> For a few months I build a new Xen server, both domU en dom0 are
>> 64-bits. I had some hardware problems, that's the reason the server is
>> not doing production-work now, but I would like to go in production real
>> soon.
>>
>> My problem is that I made this server for a longer term. And I don't see
>> a 64-bit domU in the 2.6.25 kernel, only a 32-bit domU kernel with PAE
>> support.
>>
>
> Linux 2.6.25 contains 32b xen domU support implemented on top of Linux pv_ops
> framework.
>
> pv_ops xen domU support in 2.6.25 doesn't include 64 bit support.. it is
> queued for 2.6.27.
>
>> My processor supports hardware virtualisation and I would like to use 8
>> GB RAM total. No domU is using more then 2 GB RAM.
>>
>
> So you need PAE or full 64b.
>
>> Do you think it is better to switch to a 32-bit domU?
>> And what to do with the dom0 then? There is no Debian-kernel with a
>> 32-bits PAE domU, so far I know. Not in Etch and not in Lenny.
>> Is KVM a better option for a dom0 maybe?
>
> All 32b xen kernels should be PAE now, because non-PAE xen kernels are not
> supported/developed anymore.
>
> Linux 2.6.26 pv_ops xen domU support is PAE-only.
>
> http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenParavirtOps
>
>> I am running Etch now, I would like to run Lenny soon as possible, but
>> Etch is OK for the coming year if necessary. I don't like building my
>> own kernel or using software what's not in Debian.
>
> pv_ops Linux 2.6.2(5|6|7) doesn't contain xen dom0 support..
>
> So the best option is to run etch in dom0, and lenny in domU.

Do you advice using a 32-bit or a 64-bit Etch dom0?

Thanks for your advice!

With regards,
Paul van der Vlis.




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Old 07-31-2008, 06:34 AM
Paul van der Vlis
 
Default Xen advice requested

Teodor schreef:
> On Wed, Jul 30, 2008 at 12:08 PM, Pasi Kärkkäinen <pasik@iki.fi> wrote:
>> pv_ops Linux 2.6.2(5|6|7) doesn't contain xen dom0 support..
>>
>> So the best option is to run etch in dom0, and lenny in domU.
>
> In addition to what was already said, lenny domU is only 32-bit.
> I'm running just fine lenny on dom0, but ONLY with the xen kernel from
> etch. The libc, the xen tools and all other packages (except the
> linux-image-2.6.18-6-xen-*) are from lenny. The xen tools from etch
> are incompatible with the packages from lenny (e.g. the hypervisor).

Thanks, when this works it would be great. Maybe a good idea to make
this an "supported option" for Lenny. Do you use an 32-its or a 64-bits
kernel in your dom0?

With regards,
Paul van der Vlis.




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Old 07-31-2008, 08:53 AM
Thomas Goirand
 
Default Xen advice requested

Paul van der Vlis wrote:
> Do you advice using a 32-bit or a 64-bit Etch dom0?
>
> Thanks for your advice!
>
> With regards,
> Paul van der Vlis.

Hi,

I DON'T want to hurt anybody here, so please, pkg-xen-devel team, do not
take what I'm writing here badly, you guys are doing a very hard work,
and I don't think I'd be able to manage it as good as you did.

However, I really think that the Xen kernels from Debian are not so
usable in production, and I think it's best to compile your own. It's
not that hard... If you want to do so, you can follow our howto here:

http://dtcsupport.gplhost.com/DTC-Xen/Upgrade-Your-Kernel-To-Xen

This howto assumes that you know what kernel option to select, and
include a set of patches from Debian that are compatible with the kernel
from the Xen mercurial repo. Note that the Xen kernel from Debian often
delays such patches with no reason (it happened this year with the
splice exploit that was not patched for at least 3 weeks if I remember
correctly).

The current situation is really bad, and I hope this will be solved
soon, it's really a pain that we can't use the latest kernel and have to
stick with 2.6.18. Lucky, with lot's of patches like my howto describes,
it can be used with lot's of ICH9 chipset that are recognized (which is
the biggest problem IMHO). I really hope that it's planned that the
security/kernel team continues support for 2.6.18 until the Xen troubles
are over.

If you are using a Supermicro motherboard (either: PDSMI / PDSMU /
PDSME+), let me know and I'll send you our dom0 .config for doing a
faster setup.

Thomas Goirand


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Old 07-31-2008, 11:17 AM
Teodor
 
Default Xen advice requested

On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 9:34 AM, Paul van der Vlis <paul@vandervlis.nl> wrote:
> [..] Do you use an 32-its or a 64-bits kernel in your dom0?

I've been testing both of them on dom0. Excepting some alsactl
warnings at boot, there was no problem.

Thanks


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Old 08-01-2008, 08:50 AM
Paul van der Vlis
 
Default Xen advice requested

Thomas Goirand schreef:
> Hi,
>
> I DON'T want to hurt anybody here, so please, pkg-xen-devel team, do not
> take what I'm writing here badly, you guys are doing a very hard work,
> and I don't think I'd be able to manage it as good as you did.
>
> However, I really think that the Xen kernels from Debian are not so
> usable in production

Can you tell us more about the problems you have seen?

With regards,
Paul van der Vlis.




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Old 08-01-2008, 09:05 AM
Paul van der Vlis
 
Default Xen advice requested

Teodor schreef:
> On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 9:34 AM, Paul van der Vlis <paul@vandervlis.nl> wrote:
>> [..] Do you use an 32-its or a 64-bits kernel in your dom0?
>
> I've been testing both of them on dom0. Excepting some alsactl
> warnings at boot, there was no problem.

I've been thinking about this.

A 32-bit Etch dom0 is for me not OK, because it has not PAE so I cannot
use my 8 GB RAM in this way. So stays a 64-bits Etch dom0.
Lenny does not have a 64-bits domU, so I need to use a 32-bits Lenny
domU with a 64-bits Etch dom0.

When that works, it would be fine!

But... So far I know, a 64-bits Etch dom0 has no support for 32-bits
domU's... Or is this problem gone now, maybe because you use the Lenny
Xen-tools?

Did you you create this with only Debian packages?

With regards,
Paul van der Vlis.




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Old 08-01-2008, 11:39 AM
Bastian Blank
 
Default Xen advice requested

On Fri, Aug 01, 2008 at 11:05:16AM +0200, Paul van der Vlis wrote:
> A 32-bit Etch dom0 is for me not OK, because it has not PAE so I cannot
> use my 8 GB RAM in this way.

Please explain? There is no non-PAE Xen kernel in Etch.

> But... So far I know, a 64-bits Etch dom0 has no support for 32-bits
> domU's...

No, this is correct.

> Did you you create this with only Debian packages?

There exists other Debian packages like my new kernel packages with Xen
3.1 patch.

Bastian

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