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Old 09-17-2012, 10:49 AM
Philipp Kern
 
Default mass bug filing about packages manipulating/deleting shipped files

On Mon, Sep 17, 2012 at 11:59:44AM +0200, Bernd Zeimetz wrote:
> On 09/17/2012 11:56 AM, Andreas Beckmann wrote:
> > Modifying conffiles is forbidden by policy 10.7.3
> Well, conffiles are sometimes modified due to the result of asking
> questions with debconf - at least the md5sum might change, although the
> content stays the same with debconf priority=high. Are you sure you
> didn't find such things?

If you modify conffiles through debconf config scripts, your package is RC
buggy. See also [1].

Kind regards
Philipp Kern

[1] http://release.debian.org/wheezy/rc_policy.txt


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Old 09-17-2012, 11:10 AM
Bernd Zeimetz
 
Default mass bug filing about packages manipulating/deleting shipped files

On 09/17/2012 12:49 PM, Philipp Kern wrote:
> On Mon, Sep 17, 2012 at 11:59:44AM +0200, Bernd Zeimetz wrote:
>> On 09/17/2012 11:56 AM, Andreas Beckmann wrote:
>>> Modifying conffiles is forbidden by policy 10.7.3
>> Well, conffiles are sometimes modified due to the result of asking
>> questions with debconf - at least the md5sum might change, although the
>> content stays the same with debconf priority=high. Are you sure you
>> didn't find such things?
>
> If you modify conffiles through debconf config scripts, your package is RC
> buggy. See also [1].

So we shall drop things like automatic configuration of postfix? It
actually even asks the user if the config file should be modified. That
is just one example of a lot others that jump into my mind.


--
Bernd Zeimetz Debian GNU/Linux Developer
http://bzed.de http://www.debian.org
GPG Fingerprint: ECA1 E3F2 8E11 2432 D485 DD95 EB36 171A 6FF9 435F


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Old 09-17-2012, 11:18 AM
 
Default mass bug filing about packages manipulating/deleting shipped files

On Sep 17, Bernd Zeimetz <bernd@bzed.de> wrote:

> So we shall drop things like automatic configuration of postfix? It
> actually even asks the user if the config file should be modified. That
> is just one example of a lot others that jump into my mind.
/etc/postfix/{main,master}.cf are not conffiles, so there is nothing
wrong about the postfix package.

--
ciao,
Marco
 
Old 09-17-2012, 11:19 AM
Andreas Beckmann
 
Default mass bug filing about packages manipulating/deleting shipped files

On 2012-09-17 13:10, Bernd Zeimetz wrote:
> So we shall drop things like automatic configuration of postfix? It
> actually even asks the user if the config file should be modified. That
> is just one example of a lot others that jump into my mind.

It's perfectly fine to do this on configuration files that are not
conffiles.

http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-files.html#s-config-files


Andreas


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Old 09-17-2012, 11:20 AM
Jean-Christophe Dubacq
 
Default mass bug filing about packages manipulating/deleting shipped files

On 17/09/2012 13:10, Bernd Zeimetz wrote:
> On 09/17/2012 12:49 PM, Philipp Kern wrote:
>> On Mon, Sep 17, 2012 at 11:59:44AM +0200, Bernd Zeimetz wrote:
>>> On 09/17/2012 11:56 AM, Andreas Beckmann wrote:
>>>> Modifying conffiles is forbidden by policy 10.7.3
>>> Well, conffiles are sometimes modified due to the result of asking
>>> questions with debconf - at least the md5sum might change, although the
>>> content stays the same with debconf priority=high. Are you sure you
>>> didn't find such things?
>>
>> If you modify conffiles through debconf config scripts, your package is RC
>> buggy. See also [1].
>
> So we shall drop things like automatic configuration of postfix? It
> actually even asks the user if the config file should be modified. That
> is just one example of a lot others that jump into my mind.

This just means that the concept of conffile is dying.
When trying my hand at some automatic /etc management, I discovered that
many files under /etc are not conffiles (and not in dpkg managed-files)
because of this rule.

And this means that automatic management is hard, because they are
generated by scripts, and as such, not easy to store, compare to
default, etc.

Sincerly,
--
Jean-Christophe Dubacq
 
Old 09-17-2012, 11:24 AM
Bernd Zeimetz
 
Default mass bug filing about packages manipulating/deleting shipped files

On 09/17/2012 01:18 PM, Marco d'Itri wrote:
> On Sep 17, Bernd Zeimetz <bernd@bzed.de> wrote:
>
>> So we shall drop things like automatic configuration of postfix? It
>> actually even asks the user if the config file should be modified. That
>> is just one example of a lot others that jump into my mind.
> /etc/postfix/{main,master}.cf are not conffiles, so there is nothing
> wrong about the postfix package.

Oh well yes, bad example. We still have a lot of packages which modify
/etc/default/* with debconf. Portmap, sysstat, ... - and they are
supposed to be conffiles - which is rather annoying as the default
snippets not being written by deconf would mean that you have to store
the debconf generated stuff somewhere else, and source it...
Additionally to the snipped in /etc/default. Yet another waste of
developer time.

--
Bernd Zeimetz Debian GNU/Linux Developer
http://bzed.de http://www.debian.org
GPG Fingerprint: ECA1 E3F2 8E11 2432 D485 DD95 EB36 171A 6FF9 435F


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Old 09-17-2012, 11:57 AM
Philipp Kern
 
Default mass bug filing about packages manipulating/deleting shipped files

On Mon, Sep 17, 2012 at 01:24:51PM +0200, Bernd Zeimetz wrote:
> Oh well yes, bad example. We still have a lot of packages which modify
> /etc/default/* with debconf. Portmap, sysstat, ... - and they are
> supposed to be conffiles - [...]

Why are they supposed to be conffiles? It's fine for them to be not.
(Which is true, e.g., for portmap.)

Kind regards
Philipp Kern


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Old 09-17-2012, 01:40 PM
Thomas Goirand
 
Default mass bug filing about packages manipulating/deleting shipped files

On 09/17/2012 05:56 PM, Andreas Beckmann wrote:

Hi,

another recent addition to piuparts is running debsums to see whether
shipped files are being incorrectly modified. This feature is in a
experimental stage and not available in the git repository, yet.

So far I have seen these problems:

* package modifies a conffile it ships
* package modifies a non-conffile it ships
* package deletes a (conf)file it ships

Very nice. Did you run this archive wide?
Can I see your log file?

Cheers,

Thomas


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Old 09-17-2012, 02:01 PM
Bernd Zeimetz
 
Default mass bug filing about packages manipulating/deleting shipped files

On 09/17/2012 01:57 PM, Philipp Kern wrote:
> On Mon, Sep 17, 2012 at 01:24:51PM +0200, Bernd Zeimetz wrote:
>> Oh well yes, bad example. We still have a lot of packages which modify
>> /etc/default/* with debconf. Portmap, sysstat, ... - and they are
>> supposed to be conffiles - [...]
>
> Why are they supposed to be conffiles? It's fine for them to be not.
> (Which is true, e.g., for portmap.)

To cite http://release.debian.org/wheezy/rc_policy.txt:

Packages' /etc/default scripts must be treated as configuration files.


>
> Kind regards
> Philipp Kern
>
>


--
Bernd Zeimetz Debian GNU/Linux Developer
http://bzed.de http://www.debian.org
GPG Fingerprint: ECA1 E3F2 8E11 2432 D485 DD95 EB36 171A 6FF9 435F


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Old 09-17-2012, 02:03 PM
 
Default mass bug filing about packages manipulating/deleting shipped files

On Sep 17, Bernd Zeimetz <bernd@bzed.de> wrote:

> To cite http://release.debian.org/wheezy/rc_policy.txt:
> Packages' /etc/default scripts must be treated as configuration files.
Which are not the same things as conffiles.

--
ciao,
Marco
 

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