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Old 04-25-2008, 06:34 PM
Don Armstrong
 
Default Need old Packages.gz and Release Files

On Fri, 25 Apr 2008, Gunnar Wolf wrote:
> Diffs are often quite small. The time needed to establish a
> connection is often comparable to the time a diff takes to be
> downloaded... So, even with pipelining and all, storing too many
> diffs becomes irrelevant.

There's also the (non-trivial) overhead of actually applying the diff
to consider. [The equation for the break-even point is something like:

package.gz_size/slowest_speed = (num_pdifs)[ave_pdif_size/slowest_speed+ave_pdif_apply_time]

num_pdifs = package.gz_size/link_speed
------------------------------------------------
[ave_pdif_size/link_speed+ave_pdif_apply_time]

where link_speed is the slowest link speed we think is reasonable (56K
modem?) ]

I know for most of my machines, the number of pdifs at the break-even
point tends to be around 20. [Super fast links, but not-so-hot cpus.]


Don Armstrong

--
The state must declare the child to be the most precious treasure of
the people. As long as the government is perceived as working for the
benefit of the children, the people will happily endure almost any
curtailment of liberty and almost any deprivation.
-- Adolf Hitler _Mein Kampf_ p403

http://www.donarmstrong.com http://rzlab.ucr.edu


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Old 04-25-2008, 07:40 PM
Michelle Konzack
 
Default Need old Packages.gz and Release Files

Am 2008-04-25 16:07:51, schrieb Stefano Zacchiroli:
> You are asking generically Packages without specifying a mirror. Are
> they granted to be identically replicated among all mirrors? Of course
> they *probably* are due to how mirroring works, but is it *granted* that
> there are no differences among mirrors?
>
> Would such difference inhibit proper installation due to the apt-secure
> stuff?

If you have for example the ORIGINAL CDs/DVD's of 3.1r4 I can build the
package tree from there since I have all original packages I only do not
know which packages went included in the releases...

And yes, there is a problem with the signed release files, but since I
can check my packages agains packages on <archive.debian.net> I am sure,
I have the right an unaltered ones.

And IF I recreate the packages.gz/Sources.gz, I sign it with MY key and
you CAN trust it or not...

And of course, you can pull down a couple of packages/files out of my
several million (nearly 20 TByte or ninety SCSI 300 GByte drives) and
check it against packages/files from <archive.debian.net>... :-)

Thanks, Greetings and nice Day
Michelle Konzack
Systemadministrator
24V Electronic Engineer
Tamay Dogan Network
Debian GNU/Linux Consultant


--
Linux-User #280138 with the Linux Counter, http://counter.li.org/
##################### Debian GNU/Linux Consultant #####################
Michelle Konzack Apt. 917 ICQ #328449886
+49/177/9351947 50, rue de Soultz MSN LinuxMichi
+33/6/61925193 67100 Strasbourg/France IRC #Debian (irc.icq.com)
 
Old 04-25-2008, 07:40 PM
Michelle Konzack
 
Default Need old Packages.gz and Release Files

Am 2008-04-25 16:07:51, schrieb Stefano Zacchiroli:
> You are asking generically Packages without specifying a mirror. Are
> they granted to be identically replicated among all mirrors? Of course
> they *probably* are due to how mirroring works, but is it *granted* that
> there are no differences among mirrors?
>
> Would such difference inhibit proper installation due to the apt-secure
> stuff?

If you have for example the ORIGINAL CDs/DVD's of 3.1r4 I can build the
package tree from there since I have all original packages I only do not
know which packages went included in the releases...

And yes, there is a problem with the signed release files, but since I
can check my packages agains packages on <archive.debian.net> I am sure,
I have the right an unaltered ones.

And IF I recreate the packages.gz/Sources.gz, I sign it with MY key and
you CAN trust it or not...

And of course, you can pull down a couple of packages/files out of my
several million (nearly 20 TByte or ninety SCSI 300 GByte drives) and
check it against packages/files from <archive.debian.net>... :-)

Thanks, Greetings and nice Day
Michelle Konzack
Systemadministrator
24V Electronic Engineer
Tamay Dogan Network
Debian GNU/Linux Consultant


--
Linux-User #280138 with the Linux Counter, http://counter.li.org/
##################### Debian GNU/Linux Consultant #####################
Michelle Konzack Apt. 917 ICQ #328449886
+49/177/9351947 50, rue de Soultz MSN LinuxMichi
+33/6/61925193 67100 Strasbourg/France IRC #Debian (irc.icq.com)
 
Old 04-26-2008, 07:40 AM
Andreas Metzler
 
Default Need old Packages.gz and Release Files

Gunnar Wolf <gwolf@gwolf.org> wrote:
> Thomas Weber dijo [Fri, Apr 25, 2008 at 09:25:04AM +0200]:
>> > j> By the way, it would be great if the mirrors kept more than just a
>> > j> week of Diffs.
[...]
> Diffs are often quite small. The time needed to establish a connection
> is often comparable to the time a diff takes to be downloaded... So,
> even with pipelining and all, storing too many diffs becomes
> irrelevant.

That is only true if you trying to optimize for time, instead of minimal
download volume. And I doubt that 7 days is the sweet spot, Packages.gz is
huge:

ametzler@merkel:/org/ftp.root/debian/dists/sid/main/binary-i386$ du -sh /org/ftp.root/debian/dists/sid/main/binary-i386/Packages.gz /org/ftp.root/debian/dists/sid/main/binary-i386/Packages.diff/
6,7M /org/ftp.root/debian/dists/sid/main/binary-i386/Packages.gz
344K /org/ftp.root/debian/dists/sid/main/binary-i386/Packages.diff/

cu andreas
--
`What a good friend you are to him, Dr. Maturin. His other friends are
so grateful to you.'
`I sew his ears on from time to time, sure'


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Old 04-26-2008, 07:00 PM
peter green
 
Default Need old Packages.gz and Release Files

I have had an accident on my Debian-Archiv-Server and unfortunatly the
files "Packages.gz", "Packages.bz2", "Sources.gz", "Sources.bz2" and
"Release" from the directories

Afaict snapshot.debian.net has woody down to r4 and all point release of sarge and etch.

For older point releases of woody you could grab the jigdo/template files for the CDs from
http://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/archive/jigdo/ , you will have to reconstruct a single big
packages/release file set from the broken down ones on the CDs yourself though and
unfortunately downloads of those .jigdo files seem to be hanging for me at the moment.


For potato I doubt you have much hope except for the last point release (which is availible on archive.debian.org).



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Old 04-26-2008, 07:00 PM
peter green
 
Default Need old Packages.gz and Release Files

I have had an accident on my Debian-Archiv-Server and unfortunatly the
files "Packages.gz", "Packages.bz2", "Sources.gz", "Sources.bz2" and
"Release" from the directories

Afaict snapshot.debian.net has woody down to r4 and all point release of sarge and etch.

For older point releases of woody you could grab the jigdo/template files for the CDs from
http://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/archive/jigdo/ , you will have to reconstruct a single big
packages/release file set from the broken down ones on the CDs yourself though and
unfortunately downloads of those .jigdo files seem to be hanging for me at the moment.


For potato I doubt you have much hope except for the last point release (which is availible on archive.debian.org).



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Old 04-28-2008, 06:21 PM
Goswin von Brederlow
 
Default Need old Packages.gz and Release Files

Michelle Konzack <linux4michelle@freenet.de> writes:

> Am 2008-04-25 16:07:51, schrieb Stefano Zacchiroli:
>> You are asking generically Packages without specifying a mirror. Are
>> they granted to be identically replicated among all mirrors? Of course
>> they *probably* are due to how mirroring works, but is it *granted* that
>> there are no differences among mirrors?
>>
>> Would such difference inhibit proper installation due to the apt-secure
>> stuff?

They have to be identical accross all mirrors.

Release.gpg safeguards Release
Release safeguards Packages.gz
Packages.gz safeguards foo_ver_arch.deb

If any checksum check along that line fails apt will complain.

And nobody can create the Release.gpg unless they have the key from
ftp-master. Somebody elses key won't be in apts keyring unless this is
intentionally.

> If you have for example the ORIGINAL CDs/DVD's of 3.1r4 I can build the
> package tree from there since I have all original packages I only do not
> know which packages went included in the releases...

Did anyone mention http://archive.debian.org/README yet?

> And yes, there is a problem with the signed release files, but since I
> can check my packages agains packages on <archive.debian.net> I am sure,
> I have the right an unaltered ones.
>
> And IF I recreate the packages.gz/Sources.gz, I sign it with MY key and
> you CAN trust it or not...
>
> And of course, you can pull down a couple of packages/files out of my
> several million (nearly 20 TByte or ninety SCSI 300 GByte drives) and
> check it against packages/files from <archive.debian.net>... :-)

If you get the Packages.gz, Release and Release.gpg files from a
CD/DVD set then you can verify them individually with the debian
archive key from that time and then merge them into a full list and
sign with your own key. You don't have to download anything from
archive.debian.net if you have those index file.

MfG
Goswin


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Old 04-28-2008, 06:21 PM
Goswin von Brederlow
 
Default Need old Packages.gz and Release Files

Michelle Konzack <linux4michelle@freenet.de> writes:

> Am 2008-04-25 16:07:51, schrieb Stefano Zacchiroli:
>> You are asking generically Packages without specifying a mirror. Are
>> they granted to be identically replicated among all mirrors? Of course
>> they *probably* are due to how mirroring works, but is it *granted* that
>> there are no differences among mirrors?
>>
>> Would such difference inhibit proper installation due to the apt-secure
>> stuff?

They have to be identical accross all mirrors.

Release.gpg safeguards Release
Release safeguards Packages.gz
Packages.gz safeguards foo_ver_arch.deb

If any checksum check along that line fails apt will complain.

And nobody can create the Release.gpg unless they have the key from
ftp-master. Somebody elses key won't be in apts keyring unless this is
intentionally.

> If you have for example the ORIGINAL CDs/DVD's of 3.1r4 I can build the
> package tree from there since I have all original packages I only do not
> know which packages went included in the releases...

Did anyone mention http://archive.debian.org/README yet?

> And yes, there is a problem with the signed release files, but since I
> can check my packages agains packages on <archive.debian.net> I am sure,
> I have the right an unaltered ones.
>
> And IF I recreate the packages.gz/Sources.gz, I sign it with MY key and
> you CAN trust it or not...
>
> And of course, you can pull down a couple of packages/files out of my
> several million (nearly 20 TByte or ninety SCSI 300 GByte drives) and
> check it against packages/files from <archive.debian.net>... :-)

If you get the Packages.gz, Release and Release.gpg files from a
CD/DVD set then you can verify them individually with the debian
archive key from that time and then merge them into a full list and
sign with your own key. You don't have to download anything from
archive.debian.net if you have those index file.

MfG
Goswin


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Old 04-30-2008, 02:19 PM
"Douglas A. Tutty"
 
Default Need old Packages.gz and Release Files

On Sat, Apr 26, 2008 at 08:00:58PM +0100, peter green wrote:

> For potato I doubt you have much hope except for the last point release
> (which is availible on archive.debian.org).

I have one CD (CD1?) of potato (IIRC 2.2r2) that came with my Debian
GNU/Linux Bible. If that is of any help, I could make an ISO, split it
up and perhaps email it to you a few MB at a time (I'm on dialup). You
would then just assemble the file with cat in the correct order (I'd
number the files 1,2, etc).

Doug.


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Old 05-01-2008, 03:20 PM
Michelle Konzack
 
Default Need old Packages.gz and Release Files

Am 2008-04-28 20:21:34, schrieb Goswin von Brederlow:
> > If you have for example the ORIGINAL CDs/DVD's of 3.1r4 I can build the
> > package tree from there since I have all original packages I only do not
> > know which packages went included in the releases...
>
> Did anyone mention http://archive.debian.org/README yet?

Yes, but the lists are not complete.

> If you get the Packages.gz, Release and Release.gpg files from a
> CD/DVD set then you can verify them individually with the debian
> archive key from that time and then merge them into a full list and
> sign with your own key. You don't have to download anything from
> archive.debian.net if you have those index file.

As I have written, I have nearly 20 TByte of Debian packages on my
mirror and only accidently killet the /debian/dists/ directory with all
its Packages.gz, Sources.gz, Release and releases.gpg files.

I have all downloaded I have found and arround 16% of the mirror
(generaly the last releses) restored. What I am missing, are the LISTS
of the packages from the Sub-Releases like r0, r1, ...

Since I have ONLY original Debian packages and trust them because it is
a private Non-Public mirror (up to now) I need only the Lists with the
files with its version numbers which went in the Sub-Releases to create
the Symlinks and generate the NEW Packages.gz and Sources.gz files.

Since I can not use the original GPG-Key I sign the Release files with
MY GPG-Key to be sure, no one else after me has modified it.

OK, there are peoples using my mirror, BUT THEY TRUST MY KEY even if
they have not signed it, because we have never meet us personaly.

Note: If I do bad things, peoples will find it out very fast,
and my business is ancien history...

Thanks, Greetings and nice Day
Michelle Konzack
Systemadministrator
24V Electronic Engineer
Tamay Dogan Network
Debian GNU/Linux Consultant


--
Linux-User #280138 with the Linux Counter, http://counter.li.org/
##################### Debian GNU/Linux Consultant #####################
Michelle Konzack Apt. 917 ICQ #328449886
+49/177/9351947 50, rue de Soultz MSN LinuxMichi
+33/6/61925193 67100 Strasbourg/France IRC #Debian (irc.icq.com)
 

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