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-   -   Is anyone using the Units program in a script? (http://www.linux-archive.org/debian-development/601090-anyone-using-units-program-script.html)

Don Armstrong 11-21-2011 06:11 PM

Is anyone using the Units program in a script?
 
On Sun, 20 Nov 2011, John Hasler wrote:
> Ok, I;m sure someone is. If you're that someone are you using the
> "--terse" option? If not how much hassle would it be to have add it?

I am, and I'm not, but it's not a huge deal to add it. There probably
are others, not sure how difficult it would be to change it. [For the
record, it's in the blootbot bot dpkg on #debian;
/msg dpkg convert 5 floz to L; for example.]


Don Armstrong

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Ian Jackson 11-22-2011 03:52 PM

Is anyone using the Units program in a script?
 
John Hasler writes ("Is anyone using the Units program in a script?"):
> Ok, I;m sure someone is. If you're that someone are you using the
> "--terse" option? If not how much hassle would it be to have add it?
> Upstream is considering non-backward-compatible changes.

Honestly, this is not a very good way to go about asking this
question. (Yes, I know of a script that uses "units" and which would
have to be modified.)

Upstream should (a) think hard about whether this is really necessary
(b) ask on info-gnu.

Ian.


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John Hasler 11-22-2011 04:35 PM

Is anyone using the Units program in a script?
 
Ian Jackson writes:
> Honestly, this is not a very good way to go about asking this
> question.

How do you suggest that I ask it?

> Yes, I know of a script that uses "units" and which would have to be
> modified.

Then my method of asking worked, didn't it? I've also heard from
several others. They gave me some useful details.

> Upstream should (a) think hard about whether this is really necessary
> (b) ask on info-gnu.

I assume that he did both, but I have no control over that. In any
case, he asked me and so I asked here (and on debian-user). It's the
best way I could think of to alert those members of the Debian community
who might be impacted by the change. I have suggested that this
particular change be applied only in the interactive mode.

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Bob Proulx 11-22-2011 06:43 PM

Is anyone using the Units program in a script?
 
Ian Jackson wrote:
> (b) ask on info-gnu.

Just fyi for the future but info-gnu isn't the place to ask questions.
It is for official GNU announcements only, no follow-ups, no
discussions. Discussions should happen on other lists.

Bob

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Wearing my info-gnu moderator hat.

Ian Jackson 11-23-2011 12:41 PM

Is anyone using the Units program in a script?
 
John Hasler writes ("Re: Is anyone using the Units program in a script?"):
> Ian Jackson writes:
> > Honestly, this is not a very good way to go about asking this
> > question.
>
> How do you suggest that I ask it?

Sorry, I didn't mean to criticise you. I wrote in haste. I should
have been clearer that I was suggesting that upstream could have done
better.

> > Yes, I know of a script that uses "units" and which would have to be
> > modified.
>
> Then my method of asking worked, didn't it? I've also heard from
> several others. They gave me some useful details.

I accept your implied criticism.

The program I'm thinking of is an irc robot which is not packaged in
Debian nor widely distributed. But it's an example of the kind of
thing people are likely to have cobbled together out of "units".

> > Upstream should (a) think hard about whether this is really necessary
> > (b) ask on info-gnu.
>
> I assume that he did both, but I have no control over that. In any
> case, he asked me and so I asked here (and on debian-user). It's the
> best way I could think of to alert those members of the Debian community
> who might be impacted by the change.

Right. What I meant was, can you please ask upstream to post an
announcement to info-gnu asking the same question ? I could do that
myself of course but you have a relationship with them already so if
you agree you're in a better position to do that than I am.

> I have suggested that this particular change be applied only in the
> interactive mode.

That would be good.

Bob Proulx writes ("Re: Is anyone using the Units program in a script?"):
> Ian Jackson wrote:
> > (b) ask on info-gnu.
>
> Just fyi for the future but info-gnu isn't the place to ask questions.
> It is for official GNU announcements only, no follow-ups, no
> discussions. Discussions should happen on other lists.

info-gnu is exactly the right place for a GNU maintainer to ask the
question "I plan to make an incompatible change to this program;
please let me know your opinion". That is an announcement, not a
"discussion" or a "follow-up".

Many GNU maintainers have done this in the past. I think the units
maintainer should consider whether to do it in this case. Do you
agree ?

Ian.


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Bob Proulx 11-27-2011 09:21 PM

Is anyone using the Units program in a script?
 
Ian Jackson wrote:
> Bob Proulx writes ("Re: Is anyone using the Units program in a script?"):
> > Ian Jackson wrote:
> > > (b) ask on info-gnu.
> >
> > Just fyi for the future but info-gnu isn't the place to ask questions.
> > It is for official GNU announcements only, no follow-ups, no
> > discussions. Discussions should happen on other lists.
>
> info-gnu is exactly the right place for a GNU maintainer to ask the
> question "I plan to make an incompatible change to this program;
> please let me know your opinion". That is an announcement, not a
> "discussion" or a "follow-up".
>
> Many GNU maintainers have done this in the past. I think the units
> maintainer should consider whether to do it in this case. Do you
> agree ?

I wasn't saying that one shouldn't ask the GNU maintainers and
developers. I was saying that info-gnu isn't the right list for it.
I am also not aware of any others who have done this to info-gnu
before in my living memory. It would be appropriate if it were
significant and presented reasonably, directing replies to a
discussion list. But for example when rms was soliciting input about
a major change to emacs recently even he didn't use info-gnu and
instead used info-gnu-emacs for the question.

For this type of question under discussion of a utility such as
'units' I would suggest using the bug-gnu-utils@gnu.org mailing list.
It is widely subscribed to by those interested in the utilities. It
seems like the perfect fit for this type of question and discussion.
If anyone has similar questions in the future then bug-gnu-utils is a
great place to have that discussion.

It is unfortunate that the GNU Project doesn't really have the single
unified equivalent of debian-devel for general discussion. Instead it
has several mailing lists that perform a similar function as a whole
but each targeting different purposes. And due to the nature of
things politics tends to dominate in some of the more obvious ones.

Bob

Ian Jackson 11-28-2011 11:56 AM

Is anyone using the Units program in a script?
 
Bob Proulx writes ("Re: Is anyone using the Units program in a script? [and 1 more messages]"):
> For this type of question under discussion of a utility such as
> 'units' I would suggest using the bug-gnu-utils@gnu.org mailing list.
> It is widely subscribed to by those interested in the utilities. It
> seems like the perfect fit for this type of question and discussion.
> If anyone has similar questions in the future then bug-gnu-utils is a
> great place to have that discussion.

bug-gnu-utils is I'm afraid not a good place to have that discussion.
The people who need to know that a utility they have been relying on
might change incompatibly aren't on that list.

Ian.


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