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Old 03-30-2011, 03:20 PM
Roger Leigh
 
Default /run support for wheezy?

Given that Fedora are adopting /run, and it has been something
we have wanted in the past, is anyone working on implementing
/run in Debian?

http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.linux.redhat.fedora.devel/146976
https://lwn.net/Articles/436012/


Regards,
Roger

--
.'`. Roger Leigh
: :' : Debian GNU/Linux http://people.debian.org/~rleigh/
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Old 03-30-2011, 03:29 PM
Julien Cristau
 
Default /run support for wheezy?

On Wed, Mar 30, 2011 at 16:20:10 +0100, Roger Leigh wrote:

> Given that Fedora are adopting /run, and it has been something
> we have wanted in the past, is anyone working on implementing
> /run in Debian?
>
> http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.linux.redhat.fedora.devel/146976

That seems to say "on Debian /lib/init/rw was introduced for the same
thing, but I'm using a different name just because I can". What am I
missing?

Cheers,
Julien


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Old 03-30-2011, 03:39 PM
Tollef Fog Heen
 
Default /run support for wheezy?

]] Julien Cristau

| On Wed, Mar 30, 2011 at 16:20:10 +0100, Roger Leigh wrote:
|
| > Given that Fedora are adopting /run, and it has been something
| > we have wanted in the past, is anyone working on implementing
| > /run in Debian?
| >
| > http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.linux.redhat.fedora.devel/146976

Incidentially, I just sent a mail proposing this as a release goal.

| That seems to say "on Debian /lib/init/rw was introduced for the same
| thing, but I'm using a different name just because I can". What am I
| missing?

It's a bit of an abuse of the /lib namespace. It also outlines a plan
for how to get rid of /var/run and /var/lock long-term, something I
don't believe /lib/init/rw ever tried to. It was just somewhere to
stuff random early data.

--
Tollef Fog Heen
UNIX is user friendly, it's just picky about who its friends are


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Old 03-30-2011, 08:32 PM
Goswin von Brederlow
 
Default /run support for wheezy?

Tollef Fog Heen <tfheen@err.no> writes:

> ]] Julien Cristau
>
> | On Wed, Mar 30, 2011 at 16:20:10 +0100, Roger Leigh wrote:
> |
> | > Given that Fedora are adopting /run, and it has been something
> | > we have wanted in the past, is anyone working on implementing
> | > /run in Debian?
> | >
> | > http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.linux.redhat.fedora.devel/146976
>
> Incidentially, I just sent a mail proposing this as a release goal.
>
> | That seems to say "on Debian /lib/init/rw was introduced for the same
> | thing, but I'm using a different name just because I can". What am I
> | missing?
>
> It's a bit of an abuse of the /lib namespace. It also outlines a plan
> for how to get rid of /var/run and /var/lock long-term, something I
> don't believe /lib/init/rw ever tried to. It was just somewhere to
> stuff random early data.

What subdirs will we have then?

/run/run (formerly /var/run)
/run/init (formerly /lib/init/rw)
/run/lock (formerly /var/lock)

or will one of the formerlies become the /run and the other subdirs. or
will /var/run and /lib/init/rw be merged into just /run and /run/lock
for locks?

Depending on that upgrade options change so we should nail that down
first.

MfG
Goswin


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Old 03-30-2011, 10:20 PM
Roger Leigh
 
Default /run support for wheezy?

On Wed, Mar 30, 2011 at 10:32:51PM +0200, Goswin von Brederlow wrote:
> Tollef Fog Heen <tfheen@err.no> writes:
>
> > ]] Julien Cristau
> >
> > | On Wed, Mar 30, 2011 at 16:20:10 +0100, Roger Leigh wrote:
> > |
> > | > Given that Fedora are adopting /run, and it has been something
> > | > we have wanted in the past, is anyone working on implementing
> > | > /run in Debian?
> > | >
> > | > http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.linux.redhat.fedora.devel/146976
> >
> > Incidentially, I just sent a mail proposing this as a release goal.
> >
> > | That seems to say "on Debian /lib/init/rw was introduced for the same
> > | thing, but I'm using a different name just because I can". What am I
> > | missing?
> >
> > It's a bit of an abuse of the /lib namespace. It also outlines a plan
> > for how to get rid of /var/run and /var/lock long-term, something I
> > don't believe /lib/init/rw ever tried to. It was just somewhere to
> > stuff random early data.
>
> What subdirs will we have then?
>
> /run/run (formerly /var/run)
> /run/init (formerly /lib/init/rw)
> /run/lock (formerly /var/lock)
>
> or will one of the formerlies become the /run and the other subdirs. or
> will /var/run and /lib/init/rw be merged into just /run and /run/lock
> for locks?

I've filed a bug (#620191) against initscripts containing a proposed
patch for this.
http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=620191

/var/run (→ /run)
/var/lock (→ /run/lock)
/lib/init/rw (→ /run/init)
/dev/.* (→ /run/*)
/dev/shm/.* (→ /run/*)
writable files under /etc (→ /run/*)

> Depending on that upgrade options change so we should nail that down
> first.

The bug report and attached patch highlight some of the issues
for upgrades/new installs. The patch isn't yet fully complete;
further discussion on how best to handle upgrades would be useful.

The changelog in the patch has a few items marked with TODO which
need more detailed specification. Hopefully we can get /run
going fairly soon, once these are ironed out.


Regards,
Roger

--
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: :' : Debian GNU/Linux http://people.debian.org/~rleigh/
`. `' Printing on GNU/Linux? http://gutenprint.sourceforge.net/
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Old 04-01-2011, 01:33 PM
Roger Leigh
 
Default /run support for wheezy?

On Wed, Mar 30, 2011 at 11:20:45PM +0100, Roger Leigh wrote:
> On Wed, Mar 30, 2011 at 10:32:51PM +0200, Goswin von Brederlow wrote:
> > Tollef Fog Heen <tfheen@err.no> writes:
> >
> > > ]] Julien Cristau
> > >
> > > | On Wed, Mar 30, 2011 at 16:20:10 +0100, Roger Leigh wrote:
> > > |
> > > | > Given that Fedora are adopting /run, and it has been something
> > > | > we have wanted in the past, is anyone working on implementing
> > > | > /run in Debian?
> > > | >
> > > | > http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.linux.redhat.fedora.devel/146976
> > >
> > > Incidentially, I just sent a mail proposing this as a release goal.
> > >
> > > | That seems to say "on Debian /lib/init/rw was introduced for the same
> > > | thing, but I'm using a different name just because I can". What am I
> > > | missing?
> > >
> > > It's a bit of an abuse of the /lib namespace. It also outlines a plan
> > > for how to get rid of /var/run and /var/lock long-term, something I
> > > don't believe /lib/init/rw ever tried to. It was just somewhere to
> > > stuff random early data.
> >
> > What subdirs will we have then?
> >
> > /run/run (formerly /var/run)
> > /run/init (formerly /lib/init/rw)
> > /run/lock (formerly /var/lock)
> >
> > or will one of the formerlies become the /run and the other subdirs. or
> > will /var/run and /lib/init/rw be merged into just /run and /run/lock
> > for locks?
>
> I've filed a bug (#620191) against initscripts containing a proposed
> patch for this.
> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=620191
>
> /var/run (→ /run)
> /var/lock (→ /run/lock)
> /lib/init/rw (→ /run/init)

OK, an update on progress implementing /run:

Patches filed against base-files and initscripts in #620157 and #620191.
Test packages here: http://people.debian.org/~rleigh/run/
(tested in an amd64 kvm VM; it shouldn't toast your system by
making it unbootable, but YMMV; test with caution.)

There's a couple of outstanding issues which I could use some help
with:

1) /etc/init.d/mountall.sh is broken for some reason. The "mount -a"
invocation fails. Not because it fails to mount, but it returns a
32 exit status because / and /proc are already mounted.

Possibly a result of the mtab.sh domtab() changes; but it should be
behaving identically to the old version, so possibly unrelated.
Possibly already broken and I've just exposed a bug?

2) Despite only mounting /run once, I'm seeing /run and /run/lock mounted
*again* looking at /proc/mounts. Unsure why this happens, or if it's
just artifactual. /run, /run/lock and /run/init are all correctly
visible, but this is a tad strange.

I would also appreciate any testing, especially if you're using a
nonstandard setup e.g. tmpfs on /var/run and/or /var/lock. This should
be catered for. Testing on kfreebsd would also be welcome, since the
mtab changes were done to make bind mounting work for it.


Regards,
Roger

--
.'`. Roger Leigh
: :' : Debian GNU/Linux http://people.debian.org/~rleigh/
`. `' Printing on GNU/Linux? http://gutenprint.sourceforge.net/
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Old 04-01-2011, 02:06 PM
Luca Capello
 
Default /run support for wheezy?

Hi there!

On Fri, 01 Apr 2011 15:33:44 +0200, Roger Leigh wrote:
> Patches filed against base-files and initscripts in #620157 and #620191.
> Test packages here: http://people.debian.org/~rleigh/run/
> (tested in an amd64 kvm VM; it shouldn't toast your system by
> making it unbootable, but YMMV; test with caution.)
[...]
> I would also appreciate any testing, especially if you're using a
> nonstandard setup e.g. tmpfs on /var/run and/or /var/lock.

Without having looked/tested your packages and being a bit naive, but
given that tmpfs for /var/run and /var/lock can be configured through
/etc/default/rcS, maybe it is more used than you think (and I would not
completely call it nonstandard), thus it requires a bit more caution.

Thx, bye,
Gismo / Luca
 
Old 04-01-2011, 02:12 PM
Roger Leigh
 
Default /run support for wheezy?

On Fri, Apr 01, 2011 at 02:33:44PM +0100, Roger Leigh wrote:
> On Wed, Mar 30, 2011 at 11:20:45PM +0100, Roger Leigh wrote:
> > On Wed, Mar 30, 2011 at 10:32:51PM +0200, Goswin von Brederlow wrote:
> > > Tollef Fog Heen <tfheen@err.no> writes:
> > >
> > > > ]] Julien Cristau
> > > >
> > > > | On Wed, Mar 30, 2011 at 16:20:10 +0100, Roger Leigh wrote:
> > > > |
> > > > | > Given that Fedora are adopting /run, and it has been something
> > > > | > we have wanted in the past, is anyone working on implementing
> > > > | > /run in Debian?
> > > > | >
> > > > | > http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.linux.redhat.fedora.devel/146976
> > > >
> > > > Incidentially, I just sent a mail proposing this as a release goal.
> > > >
> > > > | That seems to say "on Debian /lib/init/rw was introduced for the same
> > > > | thing, but I'm using a different name just because I can". What am I
> > > > | missing?
> > > >
> > > > It's a bit of an abuse of the /lib namespace. It also outlines a plan
> > > > for how to get rid of /var/run and /var/lock long-term, something I
> > > > don't believe /lib/init/rw ever tried to. It was just somewhere to
> > > > stuff random early data.
> > >
> > > What subdirs will we have then?
> > >
> > > /run/run (formerly /var/run)
> > > /run/init (formerly /lib/init/rw)
> > > /run/lock (formerly /var/lock)
> > >
> > > or will one of the formerlies become the /run and the other subdirs. or
> > > will /var/run and /lib/init/rw be merged into just /run and /run/lock
> > > for locks?
> >
> > I've filed a bug (#620191) against initscripts containing a proposed
> > patch for this.
> > http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=620191
> >
> > /var/run (→ /run)
> > /var/lock (→ /run/lock)
> > /lib/init/rw (→ /run/init)
>
> OK, an update on progress implementing /run:
>
> Patches filed against base-files and initscripts in #620157 and #620191.
> Test packages here: http://people.debian.org/~rleigh/run/
> (tested in an amd64 kvm VM; it shouldn't toast your system by
> making it unbootable, but YMMV; test with caution.)
>
> There's a couple of outstanding issues which I could use some help
> with:

These last issues have been resolved now, so the packages at the
above URL should be safe for general testing and use.

> I would also appreciate any testing, especially if you're using a
> nonstandard setup e.g. tmpfs on /var/run and/or /var/lock. This should
> be catered for. Testing on kfreebsd would also be welcome, since the
> mtab changes were done to make bind mounting work for it.

Testing is still very much needed.


Thanks,
Roger

--
.'`. Roger Leigh
: :' : Debian GNU/Linux http://people.debian.org/~rleigh/
`. `' Printing on GNU/Linux? http://gutenprint.sourceforge.net/
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Old 04-01-2011, 02:24 PM
Roger Leigh
 
Default /run support for wheezy?

On Fri, Apr 01, 2011 at 04:06:16PM +0200, Luca Capello wrote:
> Hi there!
>
> On Fri, 01 Apr 2011 15:33:44 +0200, Roger Leigh wrote:
> > Patches filed against base-files and initscripts in #620157 and #620191.
> > Test packages here: http://people.debian.org/~rleigh/run/
> > (tested in an amd64 kvm VM; it shouldn't toast your system by
> > making it unbootable, but YMMV; test with caution.)
> [...]
> > I would also appreciate any testing, especially if you're using a
> > nonstandard setup e.g. tmpfs on /var/run and/or /var/lock.
>
> Without having looked/tested your packages and being a bit naive, but
> given that tmpfs for /var/run and /var/lock can be configured through
> /etc/default/rcS, maybe it is more used than you think (and I would not
> completely call it nonstandard), thus it requires a bit more caution.

Not entirely sure what you mean here. We detect and deal with this
sort of setup automatically. I said "nonstandard" because TTBOMK this
feature is not widely used, and (I am given to understand) somewhat
broken. I have tested this with manual mounts, and the code is working
for me. Caution is definitely warranted though--that's why I'd like
more widespread testing so we can identify any special cases we need
to deal with in addition (if any).

If you're using RAMRUN/RAMLOCK, then you'll get the same setup, but
mounted under /run and /run/lock, with compatibility symlinks in place.
If you've set up the tmpfs mounts manually in /etc/fstab, we create
bind mounts on top since we can't create the symlinks. It will again
automatically transition when you remove the fstab entries and reboot
(or you can just remove the entries, unmount the filesystems and rerun
the mountall init script).

AFAICT, we now cater for transitioning of all previously supported
configurations, as well as unsupported (manual) setups, though if you
manually set up stuff, you'll have to manually undo your work to clean
up properly (though you'll have a fully functional system at all times).

The logic is in run_migrate() in /lib/init/mount-functions.sh called
after mounting local filesystems in /etc/init.d/mountall.sh:

#
# Migrate a directory to /run and create compatibility symlink or bind
# mount.
#
run_migrate ()
{
OLD=$1
RUN=$2

KERNEL="$(uname -s)"
OPTS=""
case "$KERNEL" in
Linux|GNU) FSTYPE=none OPTS="-obind";;
*FreeBSD) FSTYPE=nullfs ;;
*) FSTYPE=none ;;
esac

# Try to remove if a directory. Note this is safe because the
# system is not yet fully up, and nothing is allowed to use
# them yet. If the user explicitly mounted a filesystem here,
# it will be cleaned out, but this would happen later on when
# bootclean runs in any case.
if [ ! -L "$OLD" ] && [ -d "$OLD" ] ; then
rm -fr "$OLD" 2>/dev/null || true
fi

# If removal failed (directory still exists), set up bind mount.
if [ ! -L "$OLD" ] && [ -d "$OLD" ] ; then
mount -t $FSTYPE "$RUN" "$OLD" -orw $OPTS
else
# Create symlink if not already present.
if [ -L "$OLD" ] && [ "$(readlink "$OLD")" = "$RUN" ]; then
:
else
ln -fs "$RUN" "$OLD"
fi
fi
}

#
# For compatibility, create /var/run and /var/lock symlinks to /run
# and /run/lock, respectively.
#
post_mountall ()
{
# /var/run and /var/lock are now /run and /run/lock,
# respectively. Cope with filesystems being deliberately
# mounted on /var/run and /var/lock. We will create bind
# mounts from /run and /run/lock to /var/run and /var/lock if
# we can't remove the /var/run and /var/lock directories, or
# else simply create symlinks. For example, in the case that
# the user has explicitly mounted filesystems on /var/run or
# /var/lock, we bind mount over the top of them. Where no
# filesystems are mounted, we replace the directory with a
# symlink where possible.

run_migrate /var/run /run
run_migrate /var/lock /run/lock
}


Regards,
Roger

--
.'`. Roger Leigh
: :' : Debian GNU/Linux http://people.debian.org/~rleigh/
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Old 04-03-2011, 09:59 AM
Stanislav Maslovski
 
Default /run support for wheezy?

On Wed, Mar 30, 2011 at 05:29:55PM +0200, Julien Cristau wrote:
> On Wed, Mar 30, 2011 at 16:20:10 +0100, Roger Leigh wrote:
>
> > Given that Fedora are adopting /run, and it has been something
> > we have wanted in the past, is anyone working on implementing
> > /run in Debian?
> >
> > http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.linux.redhat.fedora.devel/146976
>
> That seems to say "on Debian /lib/init/rw was introduced for the same
> thing, but I'm using a different name just because I can". What am I
> missing?

Exactly, I got the same impression. Especially, when I saw that it
was listed under a summary of "exsting broken solutions".

--
Stanislav


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