FAQ Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
» Video Reviews

» Linux Archive

Linux-archive is a website aiming to archive linux email lists and to make them easily accessible for linux users/developers.


» Sponsor

» Partners

» Sponsor

Go Back   Linux Archive > Debian > Debian Development

 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
 
Old 02-03-2011, 08:05 PM
Joerg Jaspert
 
Default Upcoming FTPMaster meeting

Hello world,

i just want to take the opportunity that everyone is watching the final
preparations for Squeeze to announce our next FTPMaster meeting. Your
beloved team of FTPMasters will meet from the 21st til 27th of March in
the LinuxHotel in Essen. During the weekend one of the wanna-build
admins will join in.

Similar to our last big meeting in Essen late in 2009 we again expect to
have the archive turned off for much of the meeting time. I think
expecting just something like "one dinstall per day, with packages
accepted shortly before" is reasonable, but maybe there is a day or ten
without even that. But we will keep you updated like we did last time,
it is hard to exactly pin down today what will happen when during that
week.


As we know that the services we offer are pretty central to Debian and
many people depend on what we do, we realize there are lots of people
whose work is closely related to ours. Should you be one of those and
run a service that can profit from something we can provide, or could
profit from certain changes on our side - and you want to kick that off
to get a better service from us: Please reply to me off-list and we can
see if we can work something out for you to join us for the weekend. (I
need a reason to see if it fits into the meeting and a half-way accurate
amount your travel will cost[1]). Currently we can plan for about 3 more
people.

[1] If you fly, Cologne or Duesseldorf are nearby. Frankfurt works too,
especially good if you come in from far away. Obviously train takes
a bit longer from there.
From wherever you get in, the final train station you want to get to
is called "Horst S-Bahnhof Essen (Ruhr)".


Attached below is a tentative agenda. This is an unsorted list and we
might not get to every point. We might also have missed any number of
points, if so feel free to tell us about them.


* Switch to use release codenames primarily inside dak, not
testing/unstable/foo (if not done at release time already, which we
try)

* Database "acl" set, ie. ability to merge security into main archive,
but not have everyone see everything...

* Leaf packages. that is, the possibility of having small packages in
the archive, without bloating the packages files as a "full package"
would. Somehow, less information stored for them. Like only "Package",
"Installed-Size", "Version", "FileName", "Size", "Sha1Sum" and one new
"mainpackage:" which is simply the package name of the "full
package". maybe a one-line description entry, but thats it.

Tools like apt then take all the other missing information, including
the long desc, from the mainpackage, and voila we get the possibility
to have something like foo-config-blabla and foo-config-blubber
without much bloat. (this will need design work done now but we won't
be able to use it before wheezy or wheezy+1)

* pg9.0 fun (we want replication)

* buildd autosigning

* get rid of hurd (or discuss this)

* get rid of md5sum and one of the two shasums in packages files

* script point releases more. copy/paste from docs/README.stablefoo
works, but script is nicer.

* Throwaway DD built .debs (well, let's have the fight^Wdiscussion)

* Built-Using infrastructure (for kernel udebs and so on)

* dinstall replacement (from bash off to python). look at ducks

* fix up build queue handling so security stuff works properly

* Merge the archives codes even more, maybe end up with only one config/
directory, not one per archive

* data.debian.org

* Contents, Source-Contents

* Packages generation (needs lots of db stuff)

* Reduce the config file even more - more in the database

* Apropos the above, centralise dak's email handling / sending so it's
easier to override (i.e. even from shell scripts use a dak wrapper for
it)

* Documentation

* dak for squeeze (python 2.6, sqlalchemy 0.6, python-apt 0.7.100)

* explain the idea behind class ORMObject and friends

* remote interfaces: ORMObject has a json() method for easier debugging
but might that be a first step to provide a (maybe readonly) REST
interface to dak in the future?

--
bye, Joerg
Weaseling out of things is important to learn. It's what separates us
From the animals ... except the weasel.
 
Old 02-04-2011, 06:20 AM
Raphael Hertzog
 
Default Upcoming FTPMaster meeting

Hi,

On Thu, 03 Feb 2011, Joerg Jaspert wrote:
> Attached below is a tentative agenda. This is an unsorted list and we
> might not get to every point. We might also have missed any number of
> points, if so feel free to tell us about them.

I have not seen any word about XZ support.

When you deployed support for new source package formats, you forbid
lzma because xz was coming along and you mentioned that wheezy could have
xz enabled.

I would like to see xz allowed both for source package and for binary
packages.

So I would be glad if you added "allow XZ for source packages and fix
#556407" to your agenda.

Thanks for considering it.

> * Leaf packages. that is, the possibility of having small packages in
> the archive, without bloating the packages files as a "full package"
> would. Somehow, less information stored for them. Like only "Package",
> "Installed-Size", "Version", "FileName", "Size", "Sha1Sum" and one new
> "mainpackage:" which is simply the package name of the "full
> package". maybe a one-line description entry, but thats it.

Is that also for very small perl modules that are bundled together
currently?

Cheers,
--
Raphaël Hertzog ◈ Debian Developer

Follow my Debian News ▶ http://RaphaelHertzog.com (English)
▶ http://RaphaelHertzog.fr (Français)


--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-REQUEST@lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster@lists.debian.org
Archive: 20110204072002.GG11127@rivendell.home.ouaza.com">h ttp://lists.debian.org/20110204072002.GG11127@rivendell.home.ouaza.com
 
Old 02-04-2011, 06:27 AM
Philipp Kern
 
Default Upcoming FTPMaster meeting

On 2011-02-03, Joerg Jaspert <joerg@ganneff.de> wrote:
> * Leaf packages. that is, the possibility of having small packages in
> the archive, without bloating the packages files as a "full package"
> would. Somehow, less information stored for them. Like only "Package",
> "Installed-Size", "Version", "FileName", "Size", "Sha1Sum" and one new
> "mainpackage:" which is simply the package name of the "full
> package". maybe a one-line description entry, but thats it.
>
> Tools like apt then take all the other missing information, including
> the long desc, from the mainpackage, and voila we get the possibility
> to have something like foo-config-blabla and foo-config-blubber
> without much bloat. (this will need design work done now but we won't
> be able to use it before wheezy or wheezy+1)

Which would mean stripping Depends and doing indirection. What about,
instead, dropping two of the checksums and refering to the Description
in another file which is planned for translations of them anyway?
(I.e. refer by hash.)

Would that already help quite a bit? The description and the hashsums
probably contain a tad more entropy than the other bits and could
already help quite a bit.

(But then you're of course still bloating one Package file per arch and
there's no compression to help here.)

Kind regards
Philipp Kern


--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-REQUEST@lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster@lists.debian.org
Archive: slrniknaik.18e.trash@kelgar.0x539.de">http://lists.debian.org/slrniknaik.18e.trash@kelgar.0x539.de
 
Old 02-04-2011, 08:29 AM
Goswin von Brederlow
 
Default Upcoming FTPMaster meeting

Philipp Kern <trash@philkern.de> writes:

> On 2011-02-03, Joerg Jaspert <joerg@ganneff.de> wrote:
>> * Leaf packages. that is, the possibility of having small packages in
>> the archive, without bloating the packages files as a "full package"
>> would. Somehow, less information stored for them. Like only "Package",
>> "Installed-Size", "Version", "FileName", "Size", "Sha1Sum" and one new
>> "mainpackage:" which is simply the package name of the "full
>> package". maybe a one-line description entry, but thats it.
>>
>> Tools like apt then take all the other missing information, including
>> the long desc, from the mainpackage, and voila we get the possibility
>> to have something like foo-config-blabla and foo-config-blubber
>> without much bloat. (this will need design work done now but we won't
>> be able to use it before wheezy or wheezy+1)
>
> Which would mean stripping Depends and doing indirection. What about,
> instead, dropping two of the checksums and refering to the Description
> in another file which is planned for translations of them anyway?
> (I.e. refer by hash.)
>
> Would that already help quite a bit? The description and the hashsums
> probably contain a tad more entropy than the other bits and could
> already help quite a bit.
>
> (But then you're of course still bloating one Package file per arch and
> there's no compression to help here.)
>
> Kind regards
> Philipp Kern

You also often have

Description: foo config files
foo is bla blubber blub
long description of what foo is in general
.
This package contains the config files for foo.
Some specific detail of this package.

It would be nice to have the general stanza just once. Combine that with
using hashes to lookup the description in the translation files and you
could have this:

Package: foo-config
Version: 1.2-3
Architecture: amd64
Depends: foo, bla
Description: foo config files
Description-Hash: 0123abcd, 456789ef

0123abcd would index the generic stanza and 456789ef the specific one.

MfG
Goswin


--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-REQUEST@lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster@lists.debian.org
Archive: 87mxmctafy.fsf@frosties.localnet">http://lists.debian.org/87mxmctafy.fsf@frosties.localnet
 
Old 02-04-2011, 04:05 PM
"Eugene V. Lyubimkin"
 
Default Upcoming FTPMaster meeting

On 2011-02-04 07:27, Philipp Kern wrote:
> On 2011-02-03, Joerg Jaspert <joerg@ganneff.de> wrote:
> > * Leaf packages. that is, the possibility of having small packages in
> > the archive, without bloating the packages files as a "full package"
> > would. Somehow, less information stored for them. Like only "Package",
> > "Installed-Size", "Version", "FileName", "Size", "Sha1Sum" and one new
> > "mainpackage:" which is simply the package name of the "full
> > package". maybe a one-line description entry, but thats it.
> >
> > Tools like apt then take all the other missing information, including
> > the long desc, from the mainpackage, and voila we get the possibility
> > to have something like foo-config-blabla and foo-config-blubber
> > without much bloat. (this will need design work done now but we won't
> > be able to use it before wheezy or wheezy+1)
>
> Which would mean stripping Depends and doing indirection. What about,
> instead, dropping two of the checksums and refering to the Description
> in another file which is planned for translations of them anyway?
> (I.e. refer by hash.)

++. I don't think indirection is a good idea, it makes indexing and,
say, grepping, much harder. Also, different flavours of the same package
quite often have a bit different Depends.

I would prefer dropping only one hashsum (of 3) though.

> Would that already help quite a bit? The description and the hashsums
> probably contain a tad more entropy than the other bits and could
> already help quite a bit.

++

--
Eugene V. Lyubimkin aka JackYF, JID: jackyf.devel(maildog)gmail.com
C++/Perl developer, Debian Developer


--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-REQUEST@lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster@lists.debian.org
Archive: 20110204170547.GB7710@r500-debian">http://lists.debian.org/20110204170547.GB7710@r500-debian
 
Old 02-06-2011, 10:10 PM
Svante Signell
 
Default Upcoming FTPMaster meeting

On 2011-02-03, Joerg Jaspert <joerg@ganneff.de> wrote:
> * get rid of hurd (or discuss this)

Why? GNU/Hurd has made vast improvements during last year. Even the
Debian installer is functional. Now, with support for VMs like qemu, xen
and virtualbox, more people are showing interest in GNU/Hurd.


--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-REQUEST@lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster@lists.debian.org
Archive: 1297033825.13924.109.camel@hp.my.own.domain">http://lists.debian.org/1297033825.13924.109.camel@hp.my.own.domain
 
Old 02-07-2011, 02:06 PM
 
Default Upcoming FTPMaster meeting

On Feb 07, Svante Signell <svante.signell@telia.com> wrote:

> Now, with support for VMs like qemu, xen
> and virtualbox, more people are showing interest in GNU/Hurd.
[citation needed]

--
ciao,
Marco
 
Old 02-10-2011, 07:27 PM
Josselin Mouette
 
Default Upcoming FTPMaster meeting

Le jeudi 03 février 2011 * 22:05 +0100, Joerg Jaspert a écrit :
> Attached below is a tentative agenda. This is an unsorted list and we
> might not get to every point. We might also have missed any number of
> points, if so feel free to tell us about them.

Would it be possible to add support for ddebs?

--
.'`. Josselin Mouette
: :' :
`. `' “If you behave this way because you are blackmailed by someone,
`- […] I will see what I can do for you.” -- Jörg Schilling


--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-REQUEST@lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster@lists.debian.org
Archive: 1297369634.2375.1.camel@tomoe">http://lists.debian.org/1297369634.2375.1.camel@tomoe
 
Old 02-10-2011, 07:43 PM
Sandro Tosi
 
Default Upcoming FTPMaster meeting

On Thu, Feb 3, 2011 at 22:05, Joerg Jaspert <joerg@ganneff.de> wrote:
> * Throwaway DD built .debs (well, let's have the fight^Wdiscussion)

could you please keep in mind the bandwidth impaired and try something
that avoids to upload those binary packages in the first place? but
also something that avoids the risk of uploads without even trying to
build the package first.

Thanks,
--
Sandro Tosi (aka morph, morpheus, matrixhasu)
My website: http://matrixhasu.altervista.org/
Me at Debian: http://wiki.debian.org/SandroTosi


--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-REQUEST@lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster@lists.debian.org
Archive: AANLkTim0_Hcr8RNRHSE3QmffxmhrjorC1gip2FgSWSMV@mail .gmail.com">http://lists.debian.org/AANLkTim0_Hcr8RNRHSE3QmffxmhrjorC1gip2FgSWSMV@mail .gmail.com
 
Old 02-10-2011, 08:58 PM
Ben Hutchings
 
Default Upcoming FTPMaster meeting

On Thu, 2011-02-10 at 21:43 +0100, Sandro Tosi wrote:
> On Thu, Feb 3, 2011 at 22:05, Joerg Jaspert <joerg@ganneff.de> wrote:
> > * Throwaway DD built .debs (well, let's have the fight^Wdiscussion)
>
> could you please keep in mind the bandwidth impaired and try something
> that avoids to upload those binary packages in the first place? but
> also something that avoids the risk of uploads without even trying to
> build the package first.

Since there is no support for auto-building arch-independent binaries, I
think this would only apply to the arch-dependent binaries. And you can
already upload without those, which I always do for linux-2.6.

Ben.

--
Ben Hutchings
Once a job is fouled up, anything done to improve it makes it worse.
 

Thread Tools




All times are GMT. The time now is 09:43 PM.

VBulletin, Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO ©2007, Crawlability, Inc.
Copyright 2007 - 2008, www.linux-archive.org