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Old 05-30-2012, 09:54 PM
"Max Pyziur"
 
Default Request for CentOS stats

> John Horne wrote:
>> On Wed, 2012-05-30 at 17:00 -0400, Max Pyziur wrote:
>>
>>> Yes, lol ...
>>>
>>> I know enough about mailman that it's a cinch for the list
>>> administrator
>>> to get the headline number of subscribers.
>>>
>> Why would you want to know such numbers?
>>
> Because he doesn't like the answers we've uniformly given him for his
> problem, and is looking for a way to tell himself we're only a small group
> of snot-noses, rather than the opinionated, but
> experienced-to-very-experienced collection of people that we are.

You're sarcasm isn't particularly good, neither is your research, judging
from your apparent inability to look through list archives to find what
has or hasn't been said or discussed. And then mischaracterize an
individual.

I also don't see that answers here have been uniform; some, even many,
have been very helpful. So, thank you to those people who have taken the
time to reply and discuss the issues that I've raised.



MP
pyz@brama.com



> mark
>
> _______________________________________________
> CentOS mailing list
> CentOS@centos.org
> http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
>

_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
CentOS@centos.org
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
 
Old 05-30-2012, 10:05 PM
Paul Heinlein
 
Default Request for CentOS stats

On Wed, 30 May 2012, Max Pyziur wrote:

I also don't see that answers here have been uniform; some, even
many, have been very helpful. So, thank you to those people who have
taken the time to reply and discuss the issues that I've raised.


You haven't raised any issues. You just asked for a couple numbers.

John Horne specifically asked about the issues behind your request,
a question that you've so far declined to answer.


There are a many possible reasons to ask about the number of CentOS
installations and the scope of its user base. Since the numbers
themselves are fairly impossible to produce, it might be worth your
while to let the rest of us know the concerns prompting your request.
It may be that there are ways to address those concerns in ways that
don't involve unavailable data.


--
Paul Heinlein
heinlein@madboa.com
4538' N, 1226' W_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
CentOS@centos.org
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
 
Old 05-30-2012, 10:22 PM
"Max Pyziur"
 
Default Request for CentOS stats

> On Wed, 30 May 2012, Max Pyziur wrote:
>
>> I also don't see that answers here have been uniform; some, even
>> many, have been very helpful. So, thank you to those people who have
>> taken the time to reply and discuss the issues that I've raised.
>
> You haven't raised any issues. You just asked for a couple numbers.

You are correct. On this thread, I haven't raised any issues; I've simply
asked for some headline numbers: total installed base of servers, and the
total number of subscribers to this list. It's just to get a sense of
size.

Conversely and as an example of the type of request that I am making,
Fedoraproject gives you the number of times the different spins have been
downloaded; the NY Times give you a ranking of articles that have been
most emailed, most viewed, and the like.

I think that Fedora also tries to get a sense of its user base through a
registration process. I don't know how effective or accurate that is, but
it does offer some possibility to make comparisons.

My request has nothing to do with identities.

My request stems from the fact that I've been a Linux user since the late
1990s, starting with Redhat 5.0. I'm interested in the size of the various
Linux-oriented communities.

MP
pyz@brama.com

> John Horne specifically asked about the issues behind your request,
> a question that you've so far declined to answer.
>
> There are a many possible reasons to ask about the number of CentOS
> installations and the scope of its user base. Since the numbers
> themselves are fairly impossible to produce, it might be worth your
> while to let the rest of us know the concerns prompting your request.
> It may be that there are ways to address those concerns in ways that
> don't involve unavailable data.
>
> --
> Paul Heinlein
> heinlein@madboa.com
> 4538' N, 1226' W_______________________________________________
> CentOS mailing list
> CentOS@centos.org
> http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
>

_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
CentOS@centos.org
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
 
Old 05-30-2012, 10:36 PM
Bob Hoffman
 
Default Request for CentOS stats

On 5/30/2012 5:50 PM, Hakan Koseoglu wrote:
> I trust the administrators of the centos.org mailing lists not to give
> out any information on my subscription(s) to anyone, even including a
> count of it.
Actually, I would really like them to clean up our email addresses from
the archives.
Those pages are copied throughout the net and a lot of sites change the
'me at mysite' to me@mysite.com
and it does add to issues and such.
Never liked the mailman, majordomo, etc cause they all seem to love to
do that...post emails on the web.
_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
CentOS@centos.org
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
 
Old 05-30-2012, 10:39 PM
John R Pierce
 
Default Request for CentOS stats

On 05/30/12 3:22 PM, Max Pyziur wrote:
> You are correct. On this thread, I haven't raised any issues; I've simply
> asked for some headline numbers: total installed base of servers, and the
> total number of subscribers to this list. It's just to get a sense of
> size.
>
> Conversely and as an example of the type of request that I am making,
> Fedoraproject gives you the number of times the different spins have been
> downloaded; the NY Times give you a ranking of articles that have been
> most emailed, most viewed, and the like.


I have no idea how many 1000s of centos installs there are around the
world at my employer's sites, but I can almost guarantee you its 100s of
times more than the download counts. many of these installs use
internal yum repositories for updates, so access counts on the public
yum mirrors would be of little use either.



--
john r pierce N 37, W 122
santa cruz ca mid-left coast

_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
CentOS@centos.org
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
 
Old 05-30-2012, 10:45 PM
Hakan Koseoglu
 
Default Request for CentOS stats

On 30 May 2012 23:36, Bob Hoffman wrote:
> On 5/30/2012 5:50 PM, Hakan Koseoglu wrote:
>> I trust the administrators of the centos.org mailing lists not to give
>> out any information on my subscription(s) to anyone, even including a
>> count of it.
> Actually, I would really like them to clean up our email addresses from
> the archives.
Fair comment but I see a distinction between sending a mail out and
exposing myself and a site administrator distributing that information
w/o my knowledge unless I sign to an agreement with that provider.
Obviously so far Centos.org admins have been good on that aspect.

It's not only the emails that can be read by the web users really, any
email replies tend to have email addresses splattered. Gmail just did
for yours (and I deleted it). Anyway, now I'm definitely off-topic
(even though the topic itself appears to be rubbish).
_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
CentOS@centos.org
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
 
Old 05-30-2012, 10:49 PM
Nataraj
 
Default Request for CentOS stats

On 05/30/2012 03:36 PM, Bob Hoffman wrote:
> On 5/30/2012 5:50 PM, Hakan Koseoglu wrote:
>> I trust the administrators of the centos.org mailing lists not to give
>> out any information on my subscription(s) to anyone, even including a
>> count of it.
> Actually, I would really like them to clean up our email addresses from
> the archives.
> Those pages are copied throughout the net and a lot of sites change the
> 'me at mysite' to me@mysite.com
> and it does add to issues and such.
> Never liked the mailman, majordomo, etc cause they all seem to love to
> do that...post emails on the web.
> _______________________________________________
> CentOS mailing list
> CentOS@centos.org
> http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos

Very easy solution, create a unique email address to subscribe to the
list, then add:

whitelist envelope-to = unique-email-address
client-hostname='regex:.*.centos.org'
blacklist envelope-to = unique-email-address

Of course you need to be running something on your mailserver to let you
whitelist/blacklist on these different fields and then process whitelist
and blacklist requests in the order specified.

Using this method you get 0.0000 spam messages from being subscribed to
the list. As you've pointed out though, other list members can't
easily send you private email.

Nataraj

_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
CentOS@centos.org
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
 
Old 05-30-2012, 10:53 PM
Bob Hoffman
 
Default Request for CentOS stats

On 5/30/2012 6:49 PM, Nataraj wrote:
> On 05/30/2012 03:36 PM, Bob Hoffman wrote:
>> On 5/30/2012 5:50 PM, Hakan Koseoglu wrote:
>>> I trust the administrators of the centos.org mailing lists not to give
>>> out any information on my subscription(s) to anyone, even including a
>>> count of it.
>> Actually, I would really like them to clean up our email addresses from
>> the archives.
>> Those pages are copied throughout the net and a lot of sites change the
>> 'me at mysite' to me@mysite.com
>> and it does add to issues and such.
>> Never liked the mailman, majordomo, etc cause they all seem to love to
>> do that...post emails on the web.
>> _______________________________________________
>> CentOS mailing list
>> CentOS@centos.org
>> http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
> Very easy solution, create a unique email address to subscribe to the
> list, then add:
>
> whitelist envelope-to = unique-email-address
> client-hostname='regex:.*.centos.org'
> blacklist envelope-to = unique-email-address
>
> Of course you need to be running something on your mailserver to let you
> whitelist/blacklist on these different fields and then process whitelist
> and blacklist requests in the order specified.
>
> Using this method you get 0.0000 spam messages from being subscribed to
> the list. As you've pointed out though, other list members can't
> easily send you private email.
>
> Nataraj
>
> _______________________________________________
> CentOS mailing list
> CentOS@centos.org
> http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
>
>
lol..true, except I have a few years of the old address up there..
too late.
_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
CentOS@centos.org
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
 
Old 05-31-2012, 09:28 AM
Johnny Hughes
 
Default Request for CentOS stats

On 05/30/2012 04:00 PM, Max Pyziur wrote:
>> On 5/30/2012 3:35 PM, Karanbir Singh wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> On 05/30/2012 08:26 PM, Max Pyziur wrote:
>>>> Greetings,
>>>>
>>>> Are there any summary CentOS numbers available?
>>> yes
>>>
>>>> The number of subscribers to this email list, and the number of server
>>>> installs?
>>> There are atleast 8 subscribers to this list, and I know of atleast 4
>>> servers that run CentOS.
>>>
>>> beyond that - feel free to pull a number out of thin air - its just
>>> about as likely to be accurate as the numbers above.
>>>
>>> - KB
>>>
>> lol
> Yes, lol ...
>
> I know enough about mailman that it's a cinch for the list administrator
> to get the headline number of subscribers.
>
> So, johnny at centos.org, z00dax at centos.org, ralph at centos.org,
> herrold at centos.org should be able to tell us. No?

In all seriousness ... there are:

4287 members total

As far as servers installed, there is no way to accurately know that.
We do know that we have had more than 6 million unique IPs request data
from the 100 or so internal mirrors that serve updates.

However, we push a mirrorlist that includes external (public ... not
controlled by CentOS) as well as internal (controlled by CentOS) ... so
we have no way of knowing how many machines got updates from the
external mirrors.

One also has to take into account that some users get several IP
addresses (if they are behind a dynamic IP address) ... and that many
people use the private IP ranges of 192.168.x.x, 10.x.x.x, and
172.16.x.x and Network Address Translation and have many machines that
come from 1 IP address.

The bottom line is. we just don't know how many machines are out there.

This link gives a comparison of machines running the highest rated websites:

http://w3techs.com/technologies/details/os-linux/all/all

(CentOS is currently #2 behind Debian on that list.)

_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
CentOS@centos.org
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
 
Old 05-31-2012, 01:50 PM
Markus Falb
 
Default Request for CentOS stats

On 30.5.2012 22:48, Bob Hoffman wrote:
> On 5/30/2012 3:35 PM, Karanbir Singh wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> On 05/30/2012 08:26 PM, Max Pyziur wrote:
>>> Greetings,
>>>
>>> Are there any summary CentOS numbers available?
>> yes
>>
>>> The number of subscribers to this email list, and the number of server
>>> installs?
>> There are atleast 8 subscribers to this list, and I know of atleast 4
>> servers that run CentOS.
>>
>> beyond that - feel free to pull a number out of thin air - its just
>> about as likely to be accurate as the numbers above.
>>
>> - KB
>>
> lol

Yes, the answer was funny. The question itself proves a lack of sense
for data privacy, what a central institution may or should do and so on.
This is a very sensitive and political topic, IMO.
--
Kind Regards, Markus Falb

_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
CentOS@centos.org
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
 

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