You didn't give me some packages, so now I'm giving you some! R, TexLive, LyX, Gnumeric, etc.
I want up-to-dateish versions of TexLive, R, gnumeric, emacs, but on a
more-or-less stable base of Centos-5.2. I asked for packages in this,
but got no answers. So now I've built them and will let you try them
if you want. I used the source packages from Fedora 8 and 9.
I wanted TexLive because many of us have jumped ship to Ubuntu Linux
8.04 and it does offer TexLive, and the compatability across systems
became an issue. With Centos5.2 shipping the years-out-of-date tetex,
we were seeing things compile differently across systems. Making
TexLive compile and install required a re-build with a newer version
of poppler, but not with the absolutely newest version of poppler.
Replacing poppler required a rebuild of evince. After emerging from
dependency hell, it all seems OK. I uploaded the src.rpm files for
the packages that I actually had to re-configure, even in the
slightest. Otherwise, everything is in Fedora 8 or Fedora 9.
We use LyX to edit LaTeX, so I had to have a newer version, along with
pybliographic (which required recode). We also use Emacs and auctex
to edit LaTeX, so those had to be built as well.
All of these packages were built on a stock Centos 5.2 system, with
all components as usual EXCEPT for the ones I provide below or the
packages that can be downloaded from EPEL. As far as I can tell,
everything works as well as it does on Fedora, no better.
--
Paul E. Johnson
Professor, Political Science
1541 Lilac Lane, Room 504
University of Kansas
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07-24-2008, 08:21 PM
"Jim Perrin"
You didn't give me some packages, so now I'm giving you some! R, TexLive, LyX, Gnumeric, etc.
On Thu, Jul 24, 2008 at 4:12 PM, Paul Johnson <pauljohn32@gmail.com> wrote:
> I want up-to-dateish versions of TexLive, R, gnumeric, emacs, but on a
> more-or-less stable base of Centos-5.2. I asked for packages in this,
> but got no answers. So now I've built them and will let you try them
> if you want. I used the source packages from Fedora 8 and 9.
You might want to take a look at joining up with rpmrepo for
distribution of packages. Folks are (sometimes with good reason)
reluctant to use packages from individuals. Rpmforge/rpmrepo are
respected repositories, and you'll be able to take advantage of plenty
of developer expertise.
--
During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act.
George Orwell
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07-25-2008, 02:51 PM
"Paul Johnson"
You didn't give me some packages, so now I'm giving you some! R, TexLive, LyX, Gnumeric, etc.
On Thu, Jul 24, 2008 at 3:21 PM, Jim Perrin <jperrin@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Thu, Jul 24, 2008 at 4:12 PM, Paul Johnson <pauljohn32@gmail.com> wrote:
>> I want up-to-dateish versions of TexLive, R, gnumeric, emacs, but on a
>> more-or-less stable base of Centos-5.2. I asked for packages in this,
>> but got no answers. So now I've built them and will let you try them
>> if you want. I used the source packages from Fedora 8 and 9.
>
>
> You might want to take a look at joining up with rpmrepo for
> distribution of packages. Folks are (sometimes with good reason)
> reluctant to use packages from individuals. Rpmforge/rpmrepo are
> respected repositories, and you'll be able to take advantage of plenty
> of developer expertise.
>
Thanks for the suggestion. I've gone to http://reprepo.org and find
mostly "empty space" and links pointing nowhere.
--
Paul E. Johnson
Professor, Political Science
1541 Lilac Lane, Room 504
University of Kansas
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07-29-2008, 12:34 AM
"Paul Johnson"
You didn't give me some packages, so now I'm giving you some! R, TexLive, LyX, Gnumeric, etc.
On Mon, Jul 28, 2008 at 6:39 AM, Brent L. Bates <blbates@vigyan.com> wrote:
> You might want to check out Scientific Linux:
>
> https://www.scientificlinux.org/
>
> They include a number of things that CentOS doesn't, like `R'. I don't know
> if or how many of the other items you are looking for are on their site. Just
> check them out for yourself. They seem to try to be more up to date on some
> things than CentOS. I hope this helps some.
>
I tried Scientific Linux and found I had to re-build the same things
that I rebuild for CentOS, including R, because their versions lagged
behind the cutting edge. I switched to Centos hoping that the larger
user community would generate more contributions of updated packages
for other things, like gnumeric or such. So far, that's not panning
out, but I still have hope. I am trying to find my way into the
rpmforge rpmrepo or rpmfusion or whatever it will be called.
For Scientific Linux, I even had to build Firefox, which required
rebuilding yelp.
Maybe people will find this thread and suggest I try the Debian
off-shoots, like Ubuntu or Mint. I've been doing that too.
I'm running Ubuntu on my laptop and it is closer to what I need than
Fedora or CentOS. It has a slower-changing kernel than Fedora, but
more up-to-date applications than Centos. However,I am not installing
it in our labs or on public machines because I find it harder to
secure. On a workstation that I use personally, it is OK. For
someone making the switch from Windows to Linux, Ubuntu may be the
preferred option. But in a lab or on a widespread basis, there are
some things that hold me back.
1. The basic install of Ubuntu is less security conscious. There's no
firewall in the default installation. (That is justified on the
grounds that no public services are offered in the default
configuration. The default iptables framework allows everything.
However, users can easily install services, without realizing that
there is no firewall.) It doesn't (by default) secure the bootloader
with a password. I noticed that default users have more privilidges
in Ubuntu than Fedora (they can use fuse file system). Without having
a comprehensive knowledge of Ubuntu, I'm not sure how many other
"gotchas" are waiting. Maybe I've not found the CentOS gotchas yet.
2. It includes too many invitations to ordinary users to add/remove
packages. If somebody tries to run something that is not installed,
the shell replies "you can install that if you type sudo apt-get
install xyz". They can't do that, they don't have privileges. The
Applications menu has an add/remove package program. I don't want
users to be asked to do things for which they don't have privileges.
The whole design of the package manager is to not be automatic, but
ask for constant user intervention. Not good with many machines.
3. I do not have as much faith in the deb packaging process. For me,
this the biggest reason I'm hanging around in the RPM distributions. I
learned RPM building from the classic Maximum RPM, which is emphatic
about keeping the 'pristine source code.' If you have never built a
Debian package, you will will be in for a surprise. You can't even
build a Deb package unless you manually untar the source code and
create a directory inside it. My experience is that it is much harder
to rebuild a debian package than it is to rebuild an SRPM. Most of
the time, if you find an SRPM and you want to build it on your system,
it is as simple as "rpmbuild --rebuild whatever.src.rpm". I can't
find anything comparable to that for Debian. It is always necessary
to open up the source package.
--
Paul E. Johnson
Professor, Political Science
1541 Lilac Lane, Room 504
University of Kansas
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07-29-2008, 12:39 AM
MHR
You didn't give me some packages, so now I'm giving you some! R, TexLive, LyX, Gnumeric, etc.
On Mon, Jul 28, 2008 at 5:34 PM, Paul Johnson <pauljohn32@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I tried Scientific Linux and found I had to re-build the same things
> that I rebuild for CentOS, including R, because their versions lagged
> behind the cutting edge. I switched to Centos hoping that the larger
> user community would generate more contributions of updated packages
> for other things, like gnumeric or such.
CentOS is strictly a rebuild of Red Hat Enterprise Linux, and yes, it
lags quite a ways behind the bleeding edge, but that's what stable
distributions do.
For more cutting edge, there's Fedora; bleeding edge is more like
Ubuntu or Gentoo, but AFAIK that's pretty much it. Most of the other
distributions lag behind a little or a lot, depending on which one you
choose.
Now if you want truly bleeding edge software for your computer, and
you don't mind massive numbers of security holes and other bugs,
there's always Window$! ;^)
mhr
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07-29-2008, 12:50 AM
"Paul Johnson"
You didn't give me some packages, so now I'm giving you some! R, TexLive, LyX, Gnumeric, etc.
On Mon, Jul 28, 2008 at 7:39 PM, MHR <mhullrich@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Mon, Jul 28, 2008 at 5:34 PM, Paul Johnson <pauljohn32@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> I tried Scientific Linux and found I had to re-build the same things
>> that I rebuild for CentOS, including R, because their versions lagged
>> behind the cutting edge. I switched to Centos hoping that the larger
>> user community would generate more contributions of updated packages
>> for other things, like gnumeric or such.
>
> CentOS is strictly a rebuild of Red Hat Enterprise Linux, and yes, it
> lags quite a ways behind the bleeding edge, but that's what stable
> distributions do.
Right. We know that.
As I said in the original post, I'm looking to have a distribution
that is conservative on the kernel, disk support, network drivers,
suspend features for laptops, and all of the basic things like that.
I do not want the Fedora experience of having a palm device work in
Fedora 6, but not in Fedora 7 and 8, only to spend 20 hours reading
through debugger output and advice in bugzilla about what's gone wrong
with some kernel module or driver. I do not want to play the game
anymore of "does my wireless still work?" on a weekly basis. I don't
want to waste my "user time" trying to find out what's wrong in HAL or
the the acpi subsystem.
I don't want the desktop to change gratuitously. For me, there's been
no user-perceptible improvement in Gnome for about 4 years. As long as
it supplies a program menu and a file manager, that's enough.
I do want up-to-date applications that people here actually use, like
LaTeX, Emacs, R, Gnumeric, and the other ones I can provide. If I
can't get those from EPEL or rpmforge or wherever, I'm willing to
build those packages.
I'm offering to share that back to you, but if you don't need it, that's fine.
pj
>
> For more cutting edge, there's Fedora; bleeding edge is more like
> Ubuntu or Gentoo, but AFAIK that's pretty much it. Most of the other
> distributions lag behind a little or a lot, depending on which one you
> choose.
>
> Now if you want truly bleeding edge software for your computer, and
> you don't mind massive numbers of security holes and other bugs,
> there's always Window$! ;^)
>
> mhr
> _______________________________________________
> CentOS mailing list
> CentOS@centos.org
> http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
>
--
Paul E. Johnson
Professor, Political Science
1541 Lilac Lane, Room 504
University of Kansas
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07-29-2008, 01:08 AM
MHR
You didn't give me some packages, so now I'm giving you some! R, TexLive, LyX, Gnumeric, etc.
On Mon, Jul 28, 2008 at 5:50 PM, Paul Johnson <pauljohn32@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I do want up-to-date applications that people here actually use, like
> LaTeX, Emacs, R, Gnumeric, and the other ones I can provide. If I
> can't get those from EPEL or rpmforge or wherever, I'm willing to
> build those packages.
>
> I'm offering to share that back to you, but if you don't need it, that's fine.
>
Personally I don't, but I'm sure there are plenty of people who do,
and I think it's great that you're willing to do that.
Please don't take my POV as representing anyone but myself.
mhr
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07-29-2008, 07:29 PM
"Paul Johnson"
You didn't give me some packages, so now I'm giving you some! R, TexLive, LyX, Gnumeric, etc.
On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 3:41 AM, Ralph Angenendt <ra+centos@br-online.de> wrote:
> Paul Johnson wrote:
> There's no real process of getting your packages into CentOS at the
> moment, rpmrepo is still "finding itself", so my advice would be to
> offer those packages (and maintenance) to rpmforge, which will be in
> rpmrepo once that is up. See <https://rpmrepo.org/RPMforge/>. Getting it
> in there also will help people with Scientific Linux or other
> distributions.
>
People keep sending me to RPMforge, but apparently you don't go there
yourselves to see you are sending me nowhere. Follow your advice:
https://rpmrepo.org/RPMforge/
Go to the 2nd section called "Packagers". Click either of these:
Building RPMforge packages
Contributing RPM packages
Both links point to pages that have not yet been created.
pj
> Does that answer some of the questions?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Ralph
>
> _______________________________________________
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> CentOS@centos.org
> http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
>
>
--
Paul E. Johnson
Professor, Political Science
1541 Lilac Lane, Room 504
University of Kansas
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07-29-2008, 07:38 PM
"Lanny Marcus"
You didn't give me some packages, so now I'm giving you some! R, TexLive, LyX, Gnumeric, etc.
On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 2:29 PM, Paul Johnson <pauljohn32@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 3:41 AM, Ralph Angenendt <ra+centos@br-online.de> wrote:
>> Paul Johnson wrote:
>
>> There's no real process of getting your packages into CentOS at the
>> moment, rpmrepo is still "finding itself", so my advice would be to
>> offer those packages (and maintenance) to rpmforge, which will be in
>> rpmrepo once that is up. See <https://rpmrepo.org/RPMforge/>. Getting it
>> in there also will help people with Scientific Linux or other
>> distributions.
>>
>
> People keep sending me to RPMforge, but apparently you don't go there
> yourselves to see you are sending me nowhere. Follow your advice:
>
> https://rpmrepo.org/RPMforge/
>
> Go to the 2nd section called "Packagers". Click either of these:
>
> Building RPMforge packages
>
> Contributing RPM packages
>
> Both links point to pages that have not yet been created.
>
> pj
>
>> Does that answer some of the questions?
When I went to rpmforge.net I ended up here, after I OK'd an SSL
certificate problem:
https://rpmrepo.org/RPMforge
It looks like the site is under construction, but if you click
through, I think you might find what you are looking for.
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07-29-2008, 07:57 PM
Steve Huff
You didn't give me some packages, so now I'm giving you some! R, TexLive, LyX, Gnumeric, etc.
On Jul 29, 2008, at 3:29 PM, Paul Johnson wrote:
People keep sending me to RPMforge, but apparently you don't go there
yourselves to see you are sending me nowhere. Follow your advice:
https://rpmrepo.org/RPMforge/
Paul,
i'm sorry that you're experiencing confusion; the websites for
RPMforge and rpmrepo are incomplete right now. rather than continuing
to beat your head against a sparsely populated wiki, i'd recommend you
do the following:
1) subscribe to the appropriate RPMforge mailing list (http://lists.rpmforge.net/mailman/listinfo
) - since you're submitting new packages, you probably want the
"suggest" list. you may also want to join the "users" list.
2) post your specfiles to the suggest list. here's an example of
someone else posting a spec file (http://lists.rpmforge.net/pipermail/suggest/2008-July/000547.html
), which is then accepted by one of the admins.
i hope you won't be discouraged; even if not everyone in the CentOS
community is excited about your packages, i'm sure that someone out
there will be, and contributing them to a large, widely-used
repository like RPMforge is probably the best way to distribute them.
all the best,
-steve
--
If this were played upon a stage now, I could condemn it as an
improbable fiction. - Fabian, Twelfth Night, III,v
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You didn't give me some packages, so now I'm giving you some! R, TexLive, LyX, Gnumeric, etc.
