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Old 08-12-2011, 06:00 PM
keenerd
 
Default Private mailing list for TUs?

>> Ionut Biru <ibiru@archlinux.org> wrote:
>>> On 08/12/2011 07:16 PM, keenerd wrote:
>>> > I imaging this sort of thing would need a vote first, however.
>>> > Thoughts?
>>> >
>>>
>>> I reject the idea.

Bluewind talked a little bit of sense into me. There are two types of
of private chatter: first is informal conversations among friends. I
can see why people would want a safe non-professional place for that.
IRC is great for shooting the breeze.

The second amounts to internal TU discussions, which should be on the
public ML anyway. When it comes to applicants, we should respect them
enough to tell them why they are not ready yet. MLs are good for
work, discussion, records, process, etc. TUs do not do anything
critical enough to warrant a private ML. We let the devs worry about
those things.

I can not speak for whether the arch-dev ML should be made more open.
I am not a developer and Wikileaks has not found any dirt there. Of
course I would like to see more of what goes on. And I could complain
about the current state of things, but then I'd just be annoying the
devs.

-Kyle
http://kmkeen.com
 
Old 08-12-2011, 06:16 PM
Florian Pritz
 
Default Private mailing list for TUs?

On 12.08.2011 18:56, Hector Martinez-Seara wrote:
> It is interesting,
> it doesn't matter which is the ambit ( Ej: politics, public
> institutions, ... ), but always at the end those who have the power
> feel the need to restrict or control the flux of information. And by
> experience this need increases more and more in time. No hard feelings
> about what you say but this might end up badly.
> A friend,
> Hector
>
> PD: Transparency in not the same as anarchy. Might be that people
> don't like what is decided by those who take decisions but if it is
> done openly at least the people don't feel deceived.
>

Thanks for voicing your concerns. They made me think and for now I won't
pursue this anymore.

--
Florian Pritz
 
Old 08-12-2011, 07:29 PM
Thorsten TŲpper
 
Default Private mailing list for TUs?

On Fri, 12 Aug 2011 19:56:44 +0300
Hector Martinez-Seara <hseara@gmail.com> wrote:

> It is interesting,
> it doesn't matter which is the ambit ( Ej: politics, public
> institutions, ... ), but always at the end those who have the power
> feel the need to restrict or control the flux of information. And by
> experience this need increases more and more in time. No hard feelings
> about what you say but this might end up badly.
> A friend,
> Hector
>
> PD: Transparency in not the same as anarchy. Might be that people
> don't like what is decided by those who take decisions but if it is
> done openly at least the people don't feel deceived.

Correct, just as Keenerd already pointed out in his answer to your
mail, to make the IRC logs public is not appropriate. There are no real
decisions made, sure something like whether a package should be put
back to AUR when it does no longer build with current utilities and
there were no new releases in quite some time are discussed there and
are decided by the maintainer/the TUs (mostly these packages are
orphans).

But most of the conversations there have a private touch, from what was
eaten for dinner to "Why I don't like $BAND/$MOVIE/$WHATEVER.". Please
see the situation from this point, currently we are 24 TUs, 24 people
from all around the globe who've mostly never met each other. This
private channel has the social effect to form bonds of friendship
between strangers, even if it is not possible for everyone to be there
quite often. Clans/Guilds in the video game segment of the life/internet
work in the same way to make people cooperate easier with each other.


The reason I would've preferred a private mailing list instead of
something like arch-dev-public are the following two:
* As keenerd stated: Conversations about TU-Applicants "Hey you sponsor
him/her, since when have you had contact with the applicant? Do you
think he knows how much time he probably has to invest?" Stuff like
that, nothing for the public, yet the Applicant has access to the
mailing list archives if he becomes a TU.
* The simple problem of "Hey what do you think? Is it a good idea to do
this with my package?" not sent to this list but there and whoops
there's a split thread like it happens often with a-d-p/a-g, when
they end with more than 20 mails I easily loose focus with those.


I hope this explains my opinion, yet your concerns show, that a hand
full of threads(there were only 3 applications this year) are not worth
disbelieve from other users.

Regards,
Thorsten
--
Jabber: atsutane@freethoughts.de Blog: http://atsutane.freethoughts.de/
Key: 295AFBF4 FP: 39F8 80E5 0E49 A4D1 1341 E8F9 39E4 F17F 295A FBF4
 
Old 08-12-2011, 07:49 PM
Ray Rashif
 
Default Private mailing list for TUs?

On 12 August 2011 23:18, Florian Pritz <bluewind@xinu.at> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I think it would be nice if we had a closed mailing list for TUs only
> (and maybe devs if they want to) so we can move more important stuff
> from IRC to mail because not everyone uses IRC or is online all the time.
>
> Keep in mind that it will likely be low traffic.
>
> Any hard feelings on that?

I have no strong opinions either way. However, I do feel there should
be an equal alternative to the IRC channel , which is private.


--
GPG/PGP ID: 8AADBB10
 
Old 08-13-2011, 03:03 PM
EstÍv„o
 
Default Private mailing list for TUs?

I think that this private list will be usefull. The TUs already have a
closed IRC channel, the closed list will just follow the same idea and it
will make things easier for TUs in different timezones, as angvp said. I
don't se any problem at all.

2011/8/12 Ray Rashif <schiv@archlinux.org>

> On 12 August 2011 23:18, Florian Pritz <bluewind@xinu.at> wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > I think it would be nice if we had a closed mailing list for TUs only
> > (and maybe devs if they want to) so we can move more important stuff
> > from IRC to mail because not everyone uses IRC or is online all the time.
> >
> > Keep in mind that it will likely be low traffic.
> >
> > Any hard feelings on that?
>
> I have no strong opinions either way. However, I do feel there should
> be an equal alternative to the IRC channel , which is private.
>
>
> --
> GPG/PGP ID: 8AADBB10
>



--
EstÍv„o Valad„o
 

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