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Old 07-17-2008, 06:41 AM
Xavier
 
Default Translation errors

Xavier wrote:
> Hm, that took more time than I hoped / expected :P
>
> I am still wondering who won the medal of causing the most translation
> annoyance between me :
> http://projects.archlinux.org/?p=pacman.git;a=commitdiff;h=143135e666f5564240868 810f0b8f4bc46ff87b5
>
> (all these [Y/n] to remove)
> and Allan :
> http://projects.archlinux.org/?p=pacman.git;a=commitdiff;h=3c3cb001a441656c2afba 62f0361b83d4987339c
>
> (all these error: to remove)
>
> So you can vote now
>
> Also one of my other change became pretty sneaky with the [Y/n] change :
> http://projects.archlinux.org/?p=pacman.git;a=commitdiff;h=d5278ebb3ba94efdc9fff b7924ac66b6747d9011
>
> I almost missed that change:
> - ":: and install the new pacman version now?"))) {
> + ":: and upgrade these packages now?"))) {
>
> Anyway I hope I didn't make too much mistakes in this update :P

I think all translators should pay attention to at least the above
points I mentioned.
I only looked at the last nasty message mentioned above (upgrade these
packages now), and I see that the German translation still includes
[Y/n], and the Chinese and Spanish versions still mention pacman. I
guess Hungarian and Italian versions are fine.
That does not surprise me though, I figured all these things would be
harder to catch by people who don't follow all pacman development, so
that is totally understandable.

One last mistake I just noticed is one untranslated message in libalpm
hungarian translation :
#, c-format
msgid "removing '%s' from target list because it conflicts with '%s'
"
msgstr ""

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Old 07-17-2008, 08:52 AM
"甘露(Lu Gan)"
 
Default Translation errors

On Thu, Jul 17, 2008 at 2:41 PM, Xavier <shiningxc@gmail.com> wrote:
> Xavier wrote:
>> Hm, that took more time than I hoped / expected :P
>>
>> I am still wondering who won the medal of causing the most translation
>> annoyance between me :
>> http://projects.archlinux.org/?p=pacman.git;a=commitdiff;h=143135e666f5564240868 810f0b8f4bc46ff87b5
>>
>> (all these [Y/n] to remove)
>> and Allan :
>> http://projects.archlinux.org/?p=pacman.git;a=commitdiff;h=3c3cb001a441656c2afba 62f0361b83d4987339c
>>
>> (all these error: to remove)
>>
>> So you can vote now
>>
>> Also one of my other change became pretty sneaky with the [Y/n] change :
>> http://projects.archlinux.org/?p=pacman.git;a=commitdiff;h=d5278ebb3ba94efdc9fff b7924ac66b6747d9011
>>
>> I almost missed that change:
>> - ":: and install the new pacman version now?"))) {
>> + ":: and upgrade these packages now?"))) {
Sorry, now done.
>>
>> Anyway I hope I didn't make too much mistakes in this update :P
>
> I think all translators should pay attention to at least the above
> points I mentioned.
> I only looked at the last nasty message mentioned above (upgrade these
> packages now), and I see that the German translation still includes
> [Y/n], and the Chinese and Spanish versions still mention pacman. I
> guess Hungarian and Italian versions are fine.
> That does not surprise me though, I figured all these things would be
> harder to catch by people who don't follow all pacman development, so
> that is totally understandable.
>
> One last mistake I just noticed is one untranslated message in libalpm
> hungarian translation :
> #, c-format
> msgid "removing '%s' from target list because it conflicts with '%s'
"
> msgstr ""
>
> _______________________________________________
> pacman-dev mailing list
> pacman-dev@archlinux.org
> http://archlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/pacman-dev
>
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Old 07-17-2008, 09:03 AM
Allan McRae
 
Default Translation errors

Xavier wrote:
> Xavier wrote:
>
>> Hm, that took more time than I hoped / expected :P
>>
>> I am still wondering who won the medal of causing the most translation
>> annoyance between me :
>> http://projects.archlinux.org/?p=pacman.git;a=commitdiff;h=143135e666f5564240868 810f0b8f4bc46ff87b5
>>
>> (all these [Y/n] to remove)
>> and Allan :
>> http://projects.archlinux.org/?p=pacman.git;a=commitdiff;h=3c3cb001a441656c2afba 62f0361b83d4987339c
>>
>> (all these error: to remove)
>>
>> So you can vote now

By my count of those patches, I made 38 changes and you made 22. So I
win!



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Old 07-17-2008, 09:25 AM
Xavier
 
Default Translation errors

On Thu, Jul 17, 2008 at 11:03 AM, Allan McRae <allan@archlinux.org> wrote:
>
> By my count of those patches, I made 38 changes and you made 22. So I
> win!
>

Ahah, but mine was more annoying to delete, at least for me.
I could delete the error word quickly with dw in vim, while [Y/n] is
seen as many different words.

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Old 07-17-2008, 09:34 AM
"甘露(Lu Gan)"
 
Default Translation errors

On Thu, Jul 17, 2008 at 5:25 PM, Xavier <shiningxc@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Thu, Jul 17, 2008 at 11:03 AM, Allan McRae <allan@archlinux.org> wrote:
>>
>> By my count of those patches, I made 38 changes and you made 22. So I
>> win!
>>
>
> Ahah, but mine was more annoying to delete, at least for me.
> I could delete the error word quickly with dw in vim, while [Y/n] is
> seen as many different words.
Yeah, good for you.
>
> _______________________________________________
> pacman-dev mailing list
> pacman-dev@archlinux.org
> http://archlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/pacman-dev
>

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Old 07-17-2008, 04:50 PM
Matthias Gorissen
 
Default Translation errors

Am Donnerstag 17 Juli 2008 08:41:15 schrieb Xavier:

> and I see that the German translation still includes
> [Y/n],

... and what is even worse, it should be [J/n] in German. That particular line
was a mess in older versions, anyway.

I'll fix it this night. However, is it correct that [Y/n] still appears in the
msgid (line 1221):

msgid " Are you sure you wish to do this? [Y/n] "
msgstr " Sind Sie sicher, dass Sie dies tun mchten? [J/n]"

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Old 07-17-2008, 05:31 PM
Xavier
 
Default Translation errors

Matthias Gorissen wrote:
> Am Donnerstag 17 Juli 2008 08:41:15 schrieb Xavier:
>
>> and I see that the German translation still includes
>> [Y/n],
>
> ... and what is even worse, it should be [J/n] in German. That particular line
> was a mess in older versions, anyway.
>
> I'll fix it this night. However, is it correct that [Y/n] still appears in the
> msgid (line 1221):
>
> msgid " Are you sure you wish to do this? [Y/n] "
> msgstr " Sind Sie sicher, dass Sie dies tun mchten? [J/n]"
>

Hm good point. This one is in makepkg, so it is normal indeed, it was
not affected by the new Y/n handling inside pacman.
However, the above translation is wrong too, you have to keep the [Y/n]
intact, because the check itself is not localized.
That means that when you have to answer that question, it will only
accept yes or y (case insensitive), and not ja or j.

Again, all what said above only concerns makepkg. For pacman everything
is localized, which is why you need to translate all these strings :
[Y/n] , [y/N], YES, NO, etc

But it would probably make more sense to just do exactly the same thing
in makepkg, and it should be rather easy. Besides, as a benefit of
having only one .po file for both makepkg and pacman, we can just reuse
all the above strings.

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Old 07-17-2008, 05:34 PM
"Juan Pablo Gonzalez T."
 
Default Translation errors

El Thursday 17 July 2008 12:50:13 Matthias Gorissen escribi:
> Am Donnerstag 17 Juli 2008 08:41:15 schrieb Xavier:
> > and I see that the German translation still includes
> > [Y/n],
>
> ... and what is even worse, it should be [J/n] in German. That particular
> line was a mess in older versions, anyway.
>
> I'll fix it this night. However, is it correct that [Y/n] still appears in
> the msgid (line 1221):
>
> msgid " Are you sure you wish to do this? [Y/n] "
> msgstr " Sind Sie sicher, dass Sie dies tun mchten? [J/n]"
long time ago i changed the [Y/n] with [S/n] and the users told me that the s
key was not recognized by pacman. In that time i ask for a change in the way
of process the answer ( n for not and everything else for yes, but the idea
was rejected.)

I don't know if pacman changed that, i'm a little confused because some
translations use both (for example, the fr one).

In other words, i think you must let the [Y/n] message untouched.

if i am wrong, please tell me for change the questions options.
>
> _______________________________________________
> pacman-dev mailing list
> pacman-dev@archlinux.org
> http://archlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/pacman-dev



--
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| Juan Pablo Gonzlez Tognarelli
| http://lacasadeljota.blogspot.com
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
| Si desea verificar el origen de este correo, usted puede buscar mi llave
| gpg pblica con mi direccin en http://pgp.mit.edu/ y comprobar la firma
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
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Old 07-18-2008, 09:27 AM
"Roman Kyrylych"
 
Default Translation errors

2008/7/17 Juan Pablo Gonzalez T. <lord_jotape@yahoo.com.ar>:
> El Thursday 17 July 2008 12:50:13 Matthias Gorissen escribió:
>> Am Donnerstag 17 Juli 2008 08:41:15 schrieb Xavier:
>> > and I see that the German translation still includes
>> > [Y/n],
>>
>> ... and what is even worse, it should be [J/n] in German. That particular
>> line was a mess in older versions, anyway.
>>
>> I'll fix it this night. However, is it correct that [Y/n] still appears in
>> the msgid (line 1221):
>>
>> msgid " Are you sure you wish to do this? [Y/n] "
>> msgstr " Sind Sie sicher, dass Sie dies tun möchten? [J/n]"
> long time ago i changed the [Y/n] with [S/n] and the users told me that the s
> key was not recognized by pacman. In that time i ask for a change in the way
> of process the answer ( n for not and everything else for yes, but the idea
> was rejected.)
>
> I don't know if pacman changed that, i'm a little confused because some
> translations use both (for example, the fr one).
>
> In other words, i think you must let the [Y/n] message untouched.
>
> if i am wrong, please tell me for change the questions options.

Translation of [Y/n] is possible, but I guess it's the decision of translator
if it should be translated.
The problem it cannot be translated to some languages (e.g. East-European)
because users of those languages usually have 2-3 different keyboard layouts.
For example many people in my country use English, Ukrainian and Russian
layouts simultaneously, so switching them just to answer the [Y/n] question
is PITA.
This problem doesn't exist for users which use only Latin-based layout, I guess.

--
Roman Kyrylych (*оман Кирилич)
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Old 07-18-2008, 09:44 AM
Xavier
 
Default Translation errors

On Fri, Jul 18, 2008 at 11:27 AM, Roman Kyrylych
<roman.kyrylych@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Translation of [Y/n] is possible, but I guess it's the decision of translator
> if it should be translated.
> The problem it cannot be translated to some languages (e.g. East-European)
> because users of those languages usually have 2-3 different keyboard layouts.
> For example many people in my country use English, Ukrainian and Russian
> layouts simultaneously, so switching them just to answer the [Y/n] question
> is PITA.
> This problem doesn't exist for users which use only Latin-based layout, I guess.
>

There is a difference between the string printed : [Y/n] and the
strings used to check the output against, which are : yes , no , y , n
.
Which is why you have to translate all the following strings, and be
very careful to keep consistency :
#, c-format
msgid "[Y/n]"
msgstr ""

#, c-format
msgid "[y/N]"
msgstr ""

#, c-format
msgid "Y"
msgstr ""

#, c-format
msgid "YES"
msgstr ""

#, c-format
msgid "N"
msgstr ""

#, c-format
msgid "NO"
msgstr ""

As long as you are consistent, you indeed have the choice to translate
these or not.

All the above are currently only used in pacman. But makepkg also has
a question :
msgid " Are you sure you wish to do this? [Y/n] "
msgstr ""

This one should NOT be localized, because it currently only checks
against yes and y.
However Allan and I both proposed equivalent patches for fixing this.
But I am not sure yet if it should be applied for 3.2 or not.

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