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Old 12-07-2010, 09:21 PM
Stephen John Smoogen
 
Default User Experience improvements for Anaconda

On Tue, Dec 7, 2010 at 14:48, Chris Lumens <clumens@redhat.com> wrote:
>> - version #1 is where you can simply use 'root' as your username and
>> it'll set a root password instead of create a first user. One
>> potentially weird/awkward thing here is that I don't think it's so nice
>> to set a real person's name on a root account (is it even possible?) So
>> I think the right thing to do in the case of setting the username = root
>> is to blank out the 'Full Name' field and grey it out as well when
>> 'root' is typed in the field.
>
> Setting the name is just adding information into the line in the
> /etc/passwd file, so I don't see why you couldn't also do it for root.
> I just don't think it's too commonly done.
>
>> In both versions, you get extra screens by 'opting-in' to them via
>> checkboxes (similar to how the partitioning screen works today.)
>
> On both, we're setting up the non-root user for sudo access, yeah? *We
> should probably mention that we're doing that, though you wouldn't want
> to use the word "sudo". *Say something about how this user will be
> authorized to perform system tasks, blah blah blah.
>
> I need to spend some time thinking about these screens in the context of
> kickstart installs to make sure that whatever we allow today is still
> allowed after we make this change.

What I have been doing for my systems lately and would love as a
firstboot or similar is that I add the first user to desktop_admin_r
and then make sudo use that group as root access with password. This
allows for both "I need a password to do things" to key off the same
group. At one place we worked we just had some sort of wording like:

If you will need administrative access for this system click here: []
and that did the sudo thing for that user.


> - Chris
>
> _______________________________________________
> Anaconda-devel-list mailing list
> Anaconda-devel-list@redhat.com
> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/anaconda-devel-list
>



--
Stephen J Smoogen.
"The core skill of innovators is error recovery, not failure avoidance."
Randy Nelson, President of Pixar University.
"Let us be kind, one to another, for most of us are fighting a hard
battle." -- Ian MacLaren

_______________________________________________
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Anaconda-devel-list@redhat.com
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Old 12-08-2010, 08:09 AM
Martin Gracik
 
Default User Experience improvements for Anaconda

On Tue, 2010-12-07 at 12:58 -0500, Máirín Duffy wrote:
> On Mon, 2010-11-29 at 22:08 +0000, Chris Lumens wrote:
> > > In the end, that's what I object to. It feels like an attempt to enforce
> > > a policy that I don't agree with. Let it be default to set up a local user
> > > account. But also let it be an option to bypass that and (or in addition)
> > > set the root password.
> >
> > Part of having this discussion on the mailing list is to see what other
> > people's opinions on this are. We're always open to different
> > viewpoints and haven't really decided anything one way or the other on
> > this. I'm not willing to make a decision on it until we see some more
> > mockups, personally.
>
> Sorry it's been a week or so; I've been looking at the storage
> re-initialization popup [1].
>
> Anyway, here's a couple of different mockups (sorry if the blue is too
> much, if the aesthetics are too scary just ignore them for the meat):
>
> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Anaconda/UX_Redesign/Sudo_By_Default
>
> I did two versions;
>
> - version #1 is where you can simply use 'root' as your username and
> it'll set a root password instead of create a first user. One
> potentially weird/awkward thing here is that I don't think it's so nice
> to set a real person's name on a root account (is it even possible?) So
> I think the right thing to do in the case of setting the username = root
> is to blank out the 'Full Name' field and grey it out as well when
> 'root' is typed in the field.
>
> - version #2 is where you can 'opt-in' to setting a root password with a
> bit of an explanation as to why you don't want to do it (to discourage
> folks who might not be up for it from doing it.) The explanation on that
> screen may be BS though, I made it up.
>
> In both versions, you get extra screens by 'opting-in' to them via
> checkboxes (similar to how the partitioning screen works today.)
>
> What do you think?
>
> ~m
>
> [1]
> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Anaconda/UX_Redesign/Anaconda_Storage_Reinit
>
> _______________________________________________
> Anaconda-devel-list mailing list
> Anaconda-devel-list@redhat.com
> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/anaconda-devel-list


I like the first one, where you change the username to root more, but...

I tried doing that icon in the text entry in firstboot, but people
didn't like it, because if you don't have an icon in one of them (like
you don't in the username one), then the text is not aligned. Also what
does that Full Name icon check for?

I also learned that the warning icons are intrusive, and not everybody
knows he can hover his mouse over it, and see a tooltip, so they have no
idea why there's a warning.

This is what I did to firstboot then
http://mgracik.fedorapeople.org/create_user.png

There are no warning icons, just an apply icon, if everything is OK.
And I also think, we could change that password strength label to a
progress bar with text indicating the strength level.


--
Martin Gracik <mgracik@redhat.com>

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Anaconda-devel-list@redhat.com
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Old 12-08-2010, 08:15 AM
Martin Gracik
 
Default User Experience improvements for Anaconda

On Tue, 2010-12-07 at 15:21 -0700, Stephen John Smoogen wrote:
> On Tue, Dec 7, 2010 at 14:48, Chris Lumens <clumens@redhat.com> wrote:
> >> - version #1 is where you can simply use 'root' as your username and
> >> it'll set a root password instead of create a first user. One
> >> potentially weird/awkward thing here is that I don't think it's so nice
> >> to set a real person's name on a root account (is it even possible?) So
> >> I think the right thing to do in the case of setting the username = root
> >> is to blank out the 'Full Name' field and grey it out as well when
> >> 'root' is typed in the field.
> >
> > Setting the name is just adding information into the line in the
> > /etc/passwd file, so I don't see why you couldn't also do it for root.
> > I just don't think it's too commonly done.
> >
> >> In both versions, you get extra screens by 'opting-in' to them via
> >> checkboxes (similar to how the partitioning screen works today.)
> >
> > On both, we're setting up the non-root user for sudo access, yeah? We
> > should probably mention that we're doing that, though you wouldn't want
> > to use the word "sudo". Say something about how this user will be
> > authorized to perform system tasks, blah blah blah.
> >
> > I need to spend some time thinking about these screens in the context of
> > kickstart installs to make sure that whatever we allow today is still
> > allowed after we make this change.
>
> What I have been doing for my systems lately and would love as a
> firstboot or similar is that I add the first user to desktop_admin_r
> and then make sudo use that group as root access with password. This
> allows for both "I need a password to do things" to key off the same
> group. At one place we worked we just had some sort of wording like:
>
> If you will need administrative access for this system click here: []
> and that did the sudo thing for that user.

This should already be possible
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=462161

>
>
> > - Chris
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Anaconda-devel-list mailing list
> > Anaconda-devel-list@redhat.com
> > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/anaconda-devel-list
> >
>
>
>




--
Martin Gracik <mgracik@redhat.com>

_______________________________________________
Anaconda-devel-list mailing list
Anaconda-devel-list@redhat.com
https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/anaconda-devel-list
 
Old 12-08-2010, 08:21 PM
 
Default User Experience improvements for Anaconda

On Dec 7, 12:58pm, =?ISO-8859-1?Q?M=E1ir=EDn?= Duffy wrote:
} Subject: Re: User Experience improvements for Anaconda
>On Mon, 2010-11-29 at 22:08 +0000, Chris Lumens wrote:
>> > In the end, that's what I object to. It feels like an attempt to enforce
>> > a policy that I don't agree with. Let it be default to set up a local user
>> > account. But also let it be an option to bypass that and (or in addition)
>> > set the root password.
>>
>> Part of having this discussion on the mailing list is to see what other
>> people's opinions on this are. We're always open to different
>> viewpoints and haven't really decided anything one way or the other on
>> this. I'm not willing to make a decision on it until we see some more
>> mockups, personally.
>
>Sorry it's been a week or so; I've been looking at the storage
>re-initialization popup [1].
>
>Anyway, here's a couple of different mockups (sorry if the blue is too
>much, if the aesthetics are too scary just ignore them for the meat):
>
>https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Anaconda/UX_Redesign/Sudo_By_Default
>
>I did two versions;
>
>- version #1 is where you can simply use 'root' as your username and
>it'll set a root password instead of create a first user. One
>potentially weird/awkward thing here is that I don't think it's so nice
>to set a real person's name on a root account (is it even possible?) So
>I think the right thing to do in the case of setting the username = root
>is to blank out the 'Full Name' field and grey it out as well when
>'root' is typed in the field.
>
>- version #2 is where you can 'opt-in' to setting a root password with a
>bit of an explanation as to why you don't want to do it (to discourage
>folks who might not be up for it from doing it.) The explanation on that
>screen may be BS though, I made it up.
>
>In both versions, you get extra screens by 'opting-in' to them via
>checkboxes (similar to how the partitioning screen works today.)
>
>What do you think?

They would both let me do what I need, so I find both to be acceptable.

An idea, just for grins, for version #1 is to put the username above
the real name, and if the operator types in 'root' for the username,
then it could pre-fill the real name with 'Charlie Root' (like BSD has
had for ages ;-).

Thanks,
Steve

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