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Old 08-02-2011, 01:10 PM
Tom Gundersen
 
Default coreutils-8.12-3 initscripts-2011.06.4 net-tools-1.60-18)

Hi guys,

Sorry to resurrect an old thread, but I think the context is relevant.

On Fri, Jun 10, 2011 at 3:05 AM, Gaetan Bisson <bisson@archlinux.org> wrote:
> This upgrade intends to fix the regression of coreutils' hostname not
> being as featureful as net-tools'.
>
> Changes:
> - coreutils: revert to not building hostname
> - net-tools: revert to building hostname and dnsdomainname

At the moment we do not install net-tools as part of base, but some
tools rely on hostname being present. I think it's presence is
actually part of FHS ("hostname: Utility to show or set the system's
host name"), so a reasonable assumption I suppose.

To avoid having to install net-tools (or any binaries from it). I
thought this might be a good compromise:

Split out "coreutils-hostname" from coreutils. This new package should
conflicts=(net-tools) and be added to base. Also, net-tools should be
rebuilt to add provides=(coreutils-hostname).

An important point is that we then will only get a very basic hostname
utility which only does the minimum required to satisfy FHS (set/get
hostname). If anything more "fancy" is needed such as "hostname -f"
the legacy net-tools should be installed.

Thoughts,

Tom
 
Old 08-02-2011, 01:10 PM
Tom Gundersen
 
Default coreutils-8.12-3 initscripts-2011.06.4 net-tools-1.60-18)

Hi guys,

Sorry to resurrect an old thread, but I think the context is relevant.

On Fri, Jun 10, 2011 at 3:05 AM, Gaetan Bisson <bisson@archlinux.org> wrote:
> This upgrade intends to fix the regression of coreutils' hostname not
> being as featureful as net-tools'.
>
> Changes:
> - coreutils: revert to not building hostname
> - net-tools: revert to building hostname and dnsdomainname

At the moment we do not install net-tools as part of base, but some
tools rely on hostname being present. I think it's presence is
actually part of FHS ("hostname: Utility to show or set the system's
host name"), so a reasonable assumption I suppose.

To avoid having to install net-tools (or any binaries from it). I
thought this might be a good compromise:

Split out "coreutils-hostname" from coreutils. This new package should
conflicts=(net-tools) and be added to base. Also, net-tools should be
rebuilt to add provides=(coreutils-hostname).

An important point is that we then will only get a very basic hostname
utility which only does the minimum required to satisfy FHS (set/get
hostname). If anything more "fancy" is needed such as "hostname -f"
the legacy net-tools should be installed.

Thoughts,

Tom
 
Old 08-02-2011, 01:38 PM
Dave Reisner
 
Default coreutils-8.12-3 initscripts-2011.06.4 net-tools-1.60-18)

On Tue, Aug 02, 2011 at 03:10:01PM +0200, Tom Gundersen wrote:
> Hi guys,
>
> Sorry to resurrect an old thread, but I think the context is relevant.
>
> On Fri, Jun 10, 2011 at 3:05 AM, Gaetan Bisson <bisson@archlinux.org> wrote:
> > This upgrade intends to fix the regression of coreutils' hostname not
> > being as featureful as net-tools'.
> >
> > Changes:
> > - coreutils: revert to not building hostname
> > - net-tools: revert to building hostname and dnsdomainname
>
> At the moment we do not install net-tools as part of base, but some
> tools rely on hostname being present. I think it's presence is
> actually part of FHS ("hostname: Utility to show or set the system's
> host name"), so a reasonable assumption I suppose.
>
> To avoid having to install net-tools (or any binaries from it). I
> thought this might be a good compromise:
>
> Split out "coreutils-hostname" from coreutils. This new package should
> conflicts=(net-tools) and be added to base. Also, net-tools should be
> rebuilt to add provides=(coreutils-hostname).

provides should be very general. 'hostname' would be more appropriate.

> An important point is that we then will only get a very basic hostname
> utility which only does the minimum required to satisfy FHS (set/get
> hostname). If anything more "fancy" is needed such as "hostname -f"
> the legacy net-tools should be installed.
>
> Thoughts,

We shouldn't make people install net-tools if the goal all along has
been to move away from it. My vote is to split off the hostname binary
from inetutils, which is just as full featured as hostname from
net-tools.

dave
 
Old 08-02-2011, 01:51 PM
Tom Gundersen
 
Default coreutils-8.12-3 initscripts-2011.06.4 net-tools-1.60-18)

On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 3:38 PM, Dave Reisner <d@falconindy.com> wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 02, 2011 at 03:10:01PM +0200, Tom Gundersen wrote:
>> Split out "coreutils-hostname" from coreutils. This new package should
>> conflicts=(net-tools) and be added to base. Also, net-tools should be
>> rebuilt to add provides=(coreutils-hostname).
>
> provides should be very general. 'hostname' would be more appropriate.

Good point. In that case, I guess both packages should provide 'hostname'.

> We shouldn't make people install net-tools if the goal all along has
> been to move away from it. My vote is to split off the hostname binary
> from inetutils, which is just as full featured as hostname from
> net-tools.

That's probably even better then. It looks like inetutils is well
maintained in core anyway, so no objections from me.

Cheers,

Tom
 
Old 08-02-2011, 02:15 PM
Thomas Bächler
 
Default coreutils-8.12-3 initscripts-2011.06.4 net-tools-1.60-18)

Am 02.08.2011 15:38, schrieb Dave Reisner:
> We shouldn't make people install net-tools if the goal all along has
> been to move away from it. My vote is to split off the hostname binary
> from inetutils, which is just as full featured as hostname from
> net-tools.

All this seems like complete overkill. Why don't we just make people
install inetutils?

There are more tools from net-tools with no good replacement, like netstat.
 
Old 08-02-2011, 02:19 PM
Tom Gundersen
 
Default coreutils-8.12-3 initscripts-2011.06.4 net-tools-1.60-18)

On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 4:15 PM, Thomas Bächler <thomas@archlinux.org> wrote:
> Am 02.08.2011 15:38, schrieb Dave Reisner:
>> We shouldn't make people install net-tools if the goal all along has
>> been to move away from it. My vote is to split off the hostname binary
>> from inetutils, which is just as full featured as hostname from
>> net-tools.
>
> All this seems like complete overkill. Why don't we just make people
> install inetutils?
>
> There are more tools from net-tools with no good replacement, like netstat.

I guess we could add inetutils to base, and remove whatever binaries
it provides from net-tools. Do we know that this would not lead to any
regressions?

Cheers,

Tom
 

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