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-   -   Auto Tune - Does anybody know a usable vocoder for Linux? (http://www.linux-archive.org/64-studio-user/326444-auto-tune-does-anybody-know-usable-vocoder-linux.html)

Ralf Mardorf 02-15-2010 01:59 PM

Auto Tune - Does anybody know a usable vocoder for Linux?
 
Mathias Krause wrote:
> Hi list,
>
>
>> Daniel James wrote:
>>
>>> Sorry, I forgot to say you will need Adobe's Flash plugin installed.
>>> Works for me on 3.0 beta3.
>>>
>> Oops, after disabling the Flashblock Add-on it's here ok too.
>>
>
> Flash works fine on my 64studio b3. But i did not try that videos (will do
> that tonight...)
>
>
>> Auto-Tune doesn't kill music, it's bad usage does.
>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D.O.A._(Death_of_Auto-Tune)#Writing_and_inspiration
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8z13AjI8n4I&feature=player_embedded
>>
>>
>
>
> Does anybody of you use or know an autotune plugin/app for 64studio? I
> don't like that autotuned songs in radio, but it's a nice effect to play
> with. But i didn't find anything for linux...
>

On LAD Fons did announce a test version and before Fons somebody else
made a prestage to something similar to Auto-Tune ...

> So, what i did, was writing a small autotune dssi plugin, where you can
> play notes with midi keyboard, and tune youre voice (or other samples) to
> that note. The plugin is based on a ladspa plugin called autotalent. It is
> not really finished, but maybe, I'll finish it, some day...
>
> Regards,
> Mathias
>

... and it's exactly http://web.mit.edu/tbaran/www/autotalent.html ;).

I never tested Auto-Tune myself. Once I was thinking to download an
illegal seeded Torrent for Windows and to test autotalent, but I never
downloaded the original and never used autotalent. You can get Fons
experimental version if you ask him, he's subscribed to LAD, Jack-devel
and I guess to Ardour-Users and perhaps to some other lists too.

On Windows I did use a vocoder to produce vocoder effects and I never
needed to fix my singing. Auto-Tune anyway might be an interesting
effect, also for instruments, but because it's used to much I lost interest.

From Windows I know that there are differences for vocoders. Does
anybody know a really usable vocoder for Linux? I never tested any
vocoder with Linux.

--
Auto-Tune doesn't kill music, it's bad usage does.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D.O.A._(Death_of_Auto-Tune)#Writing_and_inspiration
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8z13AjI8n4I&feature=player_embedded

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Mathias Krause 02-15-2010 04:59 PM

Auto Tune - Does anybody know a usable vocoder for Linux?
 
Hi Ralf,


[...]
>>> Auto-Tune doesn't kill music, it's bad usage does.
>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D.O.A._(Death_of_Auto-Tune)#Writing_and_inspiration
>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8z13AjI8n4I&feature=player_embedded
>>>
>> Does anybody of you use or know an autotune plugin/app for 64studio? I
>> don't like that autotuned songs in radio, but it's a nice effect to play
>> with. But i didn't find anything for linux...
>>
>>
>
> On LAD Fons did announce a test version and before Fons somebody else
> made a prestage to something similar to Auto-Tune ...
>
>
>> So, what i did, was writing a small autotune dssi plugin, where you can
>> play notes with midi keyboard, and tune youre voice (or other samples) to
>> that note. The plugin is based on a ladspa plugin called autotalent. It is
>> not really finished, but maybe, I'll finish it, some day...
>>
>> Regards,
>> Mathias
>>
>>
>
> ... and it's exactly http://web.mit.edu/tbaran/www/autotalent.html ;).
> I never tested Auto-Tune myself. Once I was thinking to download an
> illegal seeded Torrent for Windows and to test autotalent, but I never
> downloaded the original and never used autotalent. You can get Fons
> experimental version if you ask him, he's subscribed to LAD, Jack-devel
> and I guess to Ardour-Users and perhaps to some other lists too.
>
yeah ... as i already said: I got the sources for autotalent and used
them to create my own plugin with the midi notes as input for the tuning.

> On Windows I did use a vocoder to produce vocoder effects and I never
> needed to fix my singing. Auto-Tune anyway might be an interesting
> effect, also for instruments, but because it's used to much I lost interest.
>
Yeah, i understand that. I also hate that songs which are full of that
autotune. But there some bad and some good ones:
A good one may be: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gN2hntZBIUQ
And a very terrible one:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eltxU32ur6U

> From Windows I know that there are differences for vocoders. Does
> anybody know a really usable vocoder for Linux? I never tested any
> vocoder with Linux.
>

I only know a cool vocoder which is a free vst plugin. But it sounds
really okay:
Its called vocovee (http://www.kvraudio.com/get/3433.html)

Unfortunately you can't really use it within qtractor as you have to
send midi and audio to this plugin and you know the issue with sending
audio direct back to qtractor. As a workaround you could insert a
compressor app in the audio path or us vocovee with vsthost as standalone.

I don't know a ladspa oder dssi vocoder anyway. Would be interesting...

Regards,
Mathias

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Ralf Mardorf 02-15-2010 07:55 PM

Auto Tune - Does anybody know a usable vocoder for Linux?
 
Mathias Krause wrote:
> A good one may be: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gN2hntZBIUQ
> And a very terrible one:
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eltxU32ur6U
>

Both are terrible. If those would be the only songs doing it that way I
would be fine with it, but they are like all modern songs are. By the
way I heard Ke$ha's Tik Tok as a live version on German Television,
without Auto-Tune and less brutal compression and it had a complete
different character.
I'm more thinking about using Auto-Tune similar to the way a vocoder is
used by Joe Zawinul, unfortunately I couldn't find any song where he is
using the vocoder in the internet, but instead I found a lot of Weather
Report recordings were it's audible how much better analog hardware does
sound.

> I only know a cool vocoder which is a free vst plugin. But it sounds
> really okay:
> Its called vocovee (http://www.kvraudio.com/get/3433.html)
>
> Unfortunately you can't really use it within qtractor as you have to
> send midi and audio to this plugin and you know the issue with sending
> audio direct back to qtractor. As a workaround you could insert a
> compressor app in the audio path or us vocovee with vsthost as standalone.
>
> I don't know a ladspa oder dssi vocoder anyway. Would be interesting...
>

MIDI shouldn't be needed for a vocoder. But I know a lot of trouble when
using virtual vocoders, that's why I guess Auto-Tune could replace the
vocoder.

--
Auto-Tune doesn't kill music, it's bad usage does.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D.O.A._(Death_of_Auto-Tune)#Writing_and_inspiration
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8z13AjI8n4I&feature=player_embedded

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"Mathias Krause" 02-16-2010 06:07 AM

Auto Tune - Does anybody know a usable vocoder for Linux?
 
Hi Ralf,

[...]

>> I only know a cool vocoder which is a free vst plugin. But it sounds
>> really okay:
>> Its called vocovee (http://www.kvraudio.com/get/3433.html)
>>
>> Unfortunately you can't really use it within qtractor as you have to
>> send midi and audio to this plugin and you know the issue with sending
>> audio direct back to qtractor. As a workaround you could insert a
>> compressor app in the audio path or us vocovee with vsthost as
>> standalone.
>>
>> I don't know a ladspa oder dssi vocoder anyway. Would be interesting...
>>
>
> MIDI shouldn't be needed for a vocoder. But I know a lot of trouble when
> using virtual vocoders, that's why I guess Auto-Tune could replace the
> vocoder.

What you need for a vocoder are at least to inputs. Some use the 2 stereo
inputs as single inputs. The vocoders, which are really useful (like
vocovee) generate the tuning tones from a midi input, so they have a
little synth inside. For qtractor, that means that you'll have to feed 2
audio streams (or 1 midi and 1 audio stream) into a plugin strip.

I think, Auto-Tune will never replace a vocoder. That's something
completely different: A vocoder uses the frequency spectrum of one signal
and filters another signal with the inverse of it. Autotune pitches the
incoming frequencies to new ones...

Regards,
Mathias
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Ralf Mardorf 02-16-2010 06:44 AM

Auto Tune - Does anybody know a usable vocoder for Linux?
 
Good morning Mathias :)

> What you need for a vocoder are at least to inputs. Some use the 2 stereo
> inputs as single inputs. The vocoders, which are really useful (like
> vocovee) generate the tuning tones from a midi input, so they have a
> little synth inside. For qtractor, that means that you'll have to feed 2
> audio streams (or 1 midi and 1 audio stream) into a plugin strip.
>
> I think, Auto-Tune will never replace a vocoder. That's something
> completely different: A vocoder uses the frequency spectrum of one signal
> and filters another signal with the inverse of it. Autotune pitches the
> incoming frequencies to new ones...

I know. With a vocoder we quasi can give a guitar the envelope of a
drum, but especially for "talking" instruments even stand alone multi
band hardware vocoders can be a PITA, while Auto-Tune can make vocals
sound like a talking instrument very easy. I guess also a guitar pitched
by Auto-Tune can make the guitar sound like a guitar synth, but without
the annoying latency guitar synth do have for the low strings. Just
theoretical spoken, because I never used Auto-Tune, but I used a vocoder
at home and played guitar synth in music stores. I guess a talkbox is a
good alternative for my needs, but I don't like to tinker one and I
don't want to have a flexible tube in the mouth. For Windows I've got a
good vocoder that is using single audio channels, I guess this is needed
to modify the EQs for the "carrier or better modulating signal" and for
the "modulated signal" independently. Btw. for guitar there are very
good filters available that make a guitar sound like a synth, e.g.
Native Instrument's guitar rig, but I don't know something similar for
Linux, resp. I guess Phasex is able to use any input instead of it's own
oscillators, I still need to test if this is fine for usage with a guitar.
Maybe I'll test the possibilities of autotalent or Phasex today. And I
guess there are some vocoders for Linux, I still need to test them too.
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